New Theory: from Superfluids to Higgs mechanism

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a theorem that purportedly unifies concepts from superfluidity and the Higgs mechanism, exploring implications of spontaneous symmetry breaking in various physical contexts. Participants examine the relevance of this theorem to both condensed matter physics and fundamental physics, while also discussing the nature of Goldstone bosons in non-relativistic systems.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant highlights the connection between Nambu Goldstone bosons and the Higgs mechanism, suggesting significant implications for understanding mass creation during the Big Bang.
  • Another participant notes that Anderson's work on broken symmetry has influenced the Higgs mechanism, indicating a historical context for the theorem's relevance.
  • A third participant references Laughlin and Pines, discussing the universality of low-energy phenomena and questioning the novelty of the theorem as merely a formalization of existing knowledge.
  • Concerns are raised about the clarity and generality of the theorem's results, particularly regarding the counting of Goldstone bosons in various symmetry-breaking scenarios.
  • Some participants express skepticism about the hype surrounding the theorem's implications for material design, suggesting it may not represent a significant advancement in understanding low-energy theories.
  • Questions are posed regarding the assumptions made in the theorem, particularly concerning translational and rotational invariance in the continuum limit.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a mix of interest and skepticism regarding the theorem's implications. There is no consensus on the significance of the results or their applicability across different physical contexts, indicating multiple competing views remain.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in understanding the theorem's generality, particularly in relation to spacetime symmetries and systems lacking rotational invariance. There is also uncertainty about the clarity of the assumptions made in the theorem.

Naty1
Messages
5,605
Reaction score
40
Theorem unifies superfluids and other weird materials

http://newscenter.berkeley.edu/2012/06/08/theorem-unifies-superfluids-and-other-weird-materials/

Nambu Goldstone bosons...of the Higgs Mechanism!..and phonons...from Cosmology to materials design.

“Surprisingly, the implications of spontaneous symmetry breaking on the low energy spectrum had not been worked out, in general, until the paper by Watanabe and Murayama,”

Thoughts? Insights?? Sounds BIG to this observer.

I came across this while trying to learn more about the Higgs mechanism for 'creating' mass during the Big Bang. Very unexpected to find this!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
While this is interesting (I attended a seminar recently that covered the same type of topic), it is not surprising. Note that Anderson's work on broken symmetry greatly influenced the subsequent formulation of the Higgs mechanism, so that came directly out of condensed matter.

This is just one of the numerous examples where condensed matter formulations are being applied in areas that are considered to be "fundamental physics".

Zz.
 
Laughlin and Pines also ranted a bit on the same line, in their article "The theory of everything" (PNAS 97 28 (2000)):
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC26610/
For example, they also point the relationship between the Higgs mechanism and conventional superconductivity; and that ultimately such links exist because in general low-energy phenomena do not depend on the details of the microscopic systems and are universal in some sense. The theorem this press release applies to (http://prl.aps.org/abstract/PRL/v108/i25/e251602) does a contribution to shed some more light on the "in some sense" part. It is not a new theory, just a theorem in a context which is known to be relevant in many areas of physics. I cannot judge how important this particular insight is, but maybe some other person might.

At this moment this looks to me like a standard press release which... let's say... might transport a somewhat overoptimistic view of the impact of a particular publication of the same institution. I've seen the same kind of press release applied for other articles in my own field, to articles which really did nothing extraordinary. You need to be careful with such things. It's advertisement by a university for itself.
 
The article is available at arxiv:
http://arxiv.org/abs/1203.0609
It is about counting the number of Goldstone bosons in ron-relativistic systems. This is quite interesting as for example there are no Goldstone bosons for broken rotational symmetry.
An easy theory when we have to count with Goldstone bosons would be quite useful.
 
DrDu said:
The article is available at arxiv:
http://arxiv.org/abs/1203.0609
It is about counting the number of Goldstone bosons in ron-relativistic systems. This is quite interesting as for example there are no Goldstone bosons for broken rotational symmetry.
An easy theory when we have to count with Goldstone bosons would be quite useful.

Glancing briefly at the paper, it's not clear to me that their result is consistent with your statement.

For example, suppose rotational symmetry is broken e.g. down to rotations about the z-axis. Then we have two broken generators, Jx and Jy, but even if <Jz> is non-zero, there is no way 2 - 0 = (1/2)*rank since the rank is <= 3. Of course, their counting is consistent with the single gb in a ferromagnet.

What gives?
 
More generally, its not clear how general their result is. Does it work for spacetime symmetries (a classic question even in the relativistic context)? What if the system is on a lattice and doesn't have rotational invariance at all?

At the moment I can't tell if its more than just a formalization of the old fact that ferromagnets have one gb while antiferromagnets have two, but then i wonder if their formula is really so much better than just writing down the effective theory? Nevertheless, I don't want to downplay their formula too much as it is an interesting achievement.
 
Also, in my opinion you should ignore the hype about material design and so forth. It's a neat result in an old field (which makes it more impressive), but at the end of the day its still information contained in the low energy theory which we understand very well (for goldstone bosons).
 
"We assume spatial translational invariance
and rotational invariance at sufficiently long distances in
the continuum limit, while we can still discuss their SSB."
I am not quite sure what they mean here.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
4K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
6K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
7K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
4K