Noetherian Modules: Direct Sums & Bland Proposition 4.2.7

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding a proof related to Noetherian modules, specifically focusing on Proposition 4.2.7 from Paul E. Bland's book "Rings and Their Modules." Participants explore the implications of a short exact sequence involving direct sums of modules and the conditions under which the sequence is exact.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Peter seeks clarification on the short exact sequence involving direct sums of modules and the implications of the R-module homomorphisms being "obvious."
  • Some participants assert that the mappings involved in the short exact sequence are indeed obvious, identifying specific inclusions and projections.
  • There is a discussion about proving that the kernel of the projection is contained in the image of the inclusion, which is necessary for establishing the exactness of the sequence.
  • Peter proposes that the sequence is exact at all relevant modules and seeks confirmation of this assertion.
  • Participants confirm that the sequence is correct and discuss the implications for proving that if each module \(M_i\) is Noetherian, then the direct sum \(\bigoplus_{i=1}^{n} M_i\) is also Noetherian.
  • Peter outlines an induction process to prove the Noetherian property for the direct sum of modules, referencing the short exact sequence as part of the argument.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the correctness of the short exact sequence and the implications for Noetherian modules. However, there are points of clarification needed regarding the proof process and the assumptions involved, indicating that some aspects of the discussion remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific examples and propositions from Bland's text, indicating that the discussion is deeply rooted in the material presented in the book. There is an emphasis on the need to establish exactness at all relevant points in the sequence, which has not been fully resolved in the discussion.

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I am reading Paul E. Bland's book, "Rings and Their Modules".

I am focused on Section 4.2: Noetherian and Artinian Modules and need some further help to fully understand the proof of part of Proposition 4.2.7 ... ...

Proposition 4.2.7 reads as follows:https://www.physicsforums.com/attachments/8209In the above proof, when Bland is dealing with the converse, we read the following:

" ... ... Then the short exact sequence

$$0 \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \longrightarrow M_n \longrightarrow 0$$ ... ... "Now I understand the induction argument that Bland goes on to talk about ... but we need to establish that the sequence of modules given is indeed a short exact sequence ... so ... some questions follow ... ... When an author gives a short exact sequence such as

$$0 \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \longrightarrow M_n \longrightarrow 0$$

is he/she implying that the R-linear mappings (R-module homomorphisms ...) involved are obvious ... ?If that is the case then what are the obvious R-module homomorphisms in the case of

$$0 \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \stackrel{ f }{ \longrightarrow } \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \stackrel{ g }{ \longrightarrow } M_n \longrightarrow 0$$

and how does $$\text{ I am } f = \text{ Ker } g$$ ...Peter
 
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Yes, you can assume that the R-maps are obvious, in this case;

$f = j_{n-1}$ is the inclusion $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$

and $g = p_n$ is the projection $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \longrightarrow M_n$

Of course $p_n \circ j_{n-1} = 0$, so jou have to prove that $\text{ker } p_n \subset \text{im } j_{n-1}$

Recall Example 6 p.47, before you go further.
 
steenis said:
Yes, you can assume that the R-maps are obvious, in this case;

$f = j_{n-1}$ is the inclusion $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$

and $g = p_n$ is the projection $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \longrightarrow M_n$

Of course $p_n \circ j_{n-1} = 0$, so jou have to prove that $\text{ker } p_n \subset \text{im } j_{n-1}$

Recall Example 6 p.47, before you go further.
Thanks Steenis ...

Appreciate your help and guidance...

Peter
 
steenis said:
Yes, you can assume that the R-maps are obvious, in this case;

$f = j_{n-1}$ is the inclusion $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$

and $g = p_n$ is the projection $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \longrightarrow M_n$

Of course $p_n \circ j_{n-1} = 0$, so jou have to prove that $\text{ker } p_n \subset \text{im } j_{n-1}$

Recall Example 6 p.47, before you go further.
Consider ...

$$0 \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \stackrel{ f }{ \longrightarrow } \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \stackrel{ g }{ \longrightarrow } M_n \longrightarrow 0$$

We have $$f \equiv j_{ n - 1 } \ : \ \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$$

where $$j_{ n - 1 } ( x_1, x_2, \ ... \ ... \ , x_{ n-1 } ) = ( x_1, x_2, \ ... \ ... \ , x_{ n-1 } , 0 )$$

... note that $$j_{ n - 1 }$$ is a canonical injection ( see Bland page 39)
$$g \equiv p_n \ : \ \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \longrightarrow M_n $$

where $$p_n ( x_1, x_2, \ ... \ ... \ , x_n ) = x_n $$

... note that $$p_n$$ is a canonical projection ( see Bland page 39) Now ... $$\text{ I am } f = \text{ I am } j_{ n - 1 } = M_1 \times M_2 \times \ ... \ ... \ M_{ n-1 } \times 0$$

and

$$\text{ Ker } g = \text{ Ker } p_n = = M_1 \times M_2 \times \ ... \ ... \ M_{ n-1 } \times 0$$... so ... $$\text{ I am } f = \text{ Ker } g$$Hence $$0 \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \longrightarrow M_n \longrightarrow 0$$

is a short exact sequence ...
Is that correct?

Peter
 
Last edited:
Yes, that is correct, because $j_{n-1}$ is injective en $p_n$ is surjective.

But you are not ready yet.
 
steenis said:
Yes, that is correct, because $j_{n-1}$ is injective en $p_n$ is surjective.

But you are not ready yet.
I assume that when you say: "But you are not ready yet." ... that you mean I need to show that the sequence ...$$0 \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \stackrel{ j_{ n - 1} }{ \longrightarrow } \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \stackrel{ p_n }{ \longrightarrow } M_n \stackrel{ s }{ \longrightarrow } 0$$... is not only exact at $$\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$$ (which I have shown ... ) ... but .. is also exact at $$\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i$$ and at $$M_n$$ ... ... Is that correct ...?If that is correct then note that ...

$$\text{ Ker } j_{ n-1 } = (0, 0, \ ... \ ... \ , 0)$$ ($$n -1$$ elements) $$= \text{ I am } 0$$ ...

... and ...

$$\text{ I am } p_n = M_n = \text{ Ker } s$$ ...So ... $$0 \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \stackrel{ j_{ n - 1} }{ \longrightarrow } \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \stackrel{ p_n }{ \longrightarrow } M_n \stackrel{ s }{ \longrightarrow } 0$$... is an exact sequence ...Is that correct?

Peter
 
Yes it is correct. No it is not what I meant.

You still have to prove the proposition: if $M_i$ is noetherian then $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$ is noetherian.
 
steenis said:
Yes it is correct. No it is not what I meant.

You still have to prove the proposition: if $M_i$ is noetherian then $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$ is noetherian.
Hi Steenis ... thanks for your help ...

I was happy with Bland's proof ... but anyway ...To prove ... if $M_i$ is Noetherian then $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$ is Noetherian.Assume each $$M_i$$ is Noetherian ...Now enter induction process ...

We have that $\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ 1 } M_i = M_1 $ is Noetherian ...

Assume that $$\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ m } M_i$$ is Noetherian for each integer $$n$$ such that $$1 \lt m \lt n$$ ...

Then in the short exact sequence ...

$$0 \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i \longrightarrow \bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i \longrightarrow M_n \longrightarrow 0$$ we have

$$\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n-1 } M_i$$ is Noetherian because of the assumption in the induction process ...

... and ...

$$M_n$$ is Noetherian by assumption ...

so that $$\bigoplus_{ i = 1 }^{ n } M_i$$ is Noetherian by Corollary 4.2.4 ...Thus the induction process gives us our desired result ...Is that correct?

Peter
 
Yes that is correct. I am sorry Peter, I thought it was an exercise. I didnot sleep good this night.
 
  • #10
steenis said:
Yes that is correct. I am sorry Peter, I thought it was an exercise. I didnot sleep good this night.
That is OK, Steenis ...

Good exercise anyway ... :) ...

Sorry that you didn't sleep well ...

Thanks again for your help ... it is much appreciated...

Peter
 

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