Optics - Find the location of object

  • Thread starter Thread starter Saitama
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Optics
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a concave mirror with a focal length of 30 cm placed on a horizontal surface, with water poured into it, creating a plano-convex lens effect. The objective is to determine the object placement for a specific magnification of 2, while considering the optical properties of the system.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to calculate the effective focal length of the mirror-lens combination and derive the object distance using magnification and mirror equations. Some participants question the sign conventions used for distances and the validity of the calculations leading to the object distance.

Discussion Status

Participants are exploring the implications of the calculations and questioning the correctness of the original answer. There is an acknowledgment of potential errors in the provided solution, but no consensus has been reached regarding the final outcome.

Contextual Notes

There is uncertainty regarding the sign conventions for distances in the context of the mirror and lens setup, which may affect the interpretation of the results. Participants also note the possibility of inaccuracies in the source material being referenced.

Saitama
Messages
4,244
Reaction score
93

Homework Statement


A concave mirror of focal length 30 cm is placed on the flat horizontal surface with its concave side up. Water with refractive index 1.33 is poured into the lens. Where should an object be placed if its image is to be captured on a screen with a magnification of 2.

Ans: 67.5 cm


Homework Equations





The Attempt at a Solution


I have attached a sketch of the given problem. I assume that the downward direction is positive.

The water poured acts as a plano-convex lens. The lens with the concave mirror acts a mirror and the focal length (##f_e##) of this combination is given by:
$$\frac{1}{f_e}=\frac{1}{f_m}-\frac{2}{f_L}$$
where ##f_m## is the focal length of mirror and ##f_L## is focal length of lens.

Calculating focal length of lens:
$$\frac{1}{f_L}=\left(\frac{4}{3}-1\right)\left(\frac{1}{\infty}-\frac{1}{R}\right)$$
where R is the radius of the convex part of lens and I have also approximated 1.33 as 4/3.
Also ##R=2f_m##, hence
$$\frac{1}{f_L}=-\frac{1}{6f_m}$$
Therefore,
$$\frac{1}{f_e}=\frac{4}{3f_m}$$
Since ##f_m=-30\, cm##, ##f_e=-90/4 \, cm##.
The given combination works like a concave mirror. As the image is to be captured on a screen, the image must be real and hence the magnification (m) is -2. For a mirror,
$$m=\frac{-v}{u} \Rightarrow -2=\frac{-v}{u} \Rightarrow v=2u$$
where v is the image distance and u is the object distance from the combination.
$$\frac{1}{v}+\frac{1}{u}=\frac{1}{f_e} \Rightarrow \frac{3}{2u}=\frac{-4}{90}$$
Solving for u gives u=-135/4 cm which is wrong.

Any help is appreciated. Thanks!
 

Attachments

  • optics2.png
    optics2.png
    5.5 KB · Views: 499
Physics news on Phys.org
You have chosen a distance positive if it is behind the mirror. The object is put in front of the mirror, and the final image is also in front of the mirror. It would have more sense to take these distances positive.

As for the absolute value of u, I got exactly the same result as you.

ehild
 
ehild said:
As for the absolute value of u, I got exactly the same result as you.

ehild

Does this mean that the given answer is wrong?
 
I am not sure, but it might be wrong.

ehild
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: 1 person
ehild said:
I am not sure, but it might be wrong.

ehild

I am sure you are right, I have often seen wrong answers in the book I am using.

Thanks for the check ehild! :smile:
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K