Partial derivative of a total derivative

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of a partial derivative of a total derivative in the context of evaluating a Jacobian. Participants explore the application of this concept in solving systems of differential equations, particularly using the Newton-Raphson method.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation, Mathematical reasoning, Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about calculating ∂(df/dx)/∂f in relation to the Jacobian.
  • Another participant suggests that the Jacobian is typically used for converting integrals between coordinate systems, providing an example involving polar coordinates.
  • A participant confirms the relevance of the example, explaining the need to evaluate ∂f1/∂y1 in the context of a differential equation and the Newton-Raphson method, leading to the expression ∂(dy1/dx1)/∂y1.
  • One participant references the chain rule as a relevant concept in the discussion, indicating its potential application in the calculations being discussed.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants appear to have differing views on the applicability of the example provided, with some focusing on the Jacobian's role in coordinate transformations while others emphasize its use in differential equations. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specific calculation of the partial derivative of the total derivative.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not fully clarified the assumptions underlying their examples or the specific definitions they are using, which may affect the interpretation of the calculations discussed.

halley00
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Hi,

So, in order to calculate a Jacobian, I need to evaluate a partial derivative of a total derivative, i.e.
Let's say I have a function f(x), how do I calculate something like: ∂(df/dx)/∂f?
 
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Is this an actual example or something you just thought of?

I can see you using the Jacobian to convert an integral from say XY cartesian coordinates to polar coordinates but not using f(x) by itself.

integral ( f(x,y) dx dy) ---> integral (f(r,phi) Jacobian(r,phi) dr dphi)

So you'd start with x=r * cos(phi) and y=r * sin(phi) and compute the Jacobian
and then you'd convert f(x,y) to f(r,phi)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacobian_matrix_and_determinant

Here's a short video tutorial on the Jacobian:

 
Last edited:
Thank you for your reply. It is an actual example. I have to solve a system of differential equations using Newton-Raphson method, so, let's say I have a function: f1(y1(x1),y2(x1,x2)) = 0, with something like f1 =dy1/dx1 + something else. Then to construct the Jacobian I'll need to evaluate ∂f1/∂y1, which will lead to ∂(dy1/dx1)/∂y1. Any leads?
 
halley00 said:
Thank you for your reply. It is an actual example. I have to solve a system of differential equations using Newton-Raphson method, so, let's say I have a function: f1(y1(x1),y2(x1,x2)) = 0, with something like f1 =dy1/dx1 + something else. Then to construct the Jacobian I'll need to evaluate ∂f1/∂y1, which will lead to ∂(dy1/dx1)/∂y1. Any leads?

Remember the chain rule?

∂f1/∂y1 * ∂y1/∂x1 = ∂f1/∂x1
 

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