Passion or Talent: What Really Matters in Choosing a Career Path?

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SUMMARY

The forum discussion centers on the dilemma faced by a 12th-grade student torn between pursuing a career in mechanical engineering and the pressure to become a footballer due to perceived talent. The student expresses a strong desire to work hard and overcome academic challenges despite having a lower IQ score of 80-90 and average grades in physics and mathematics. Participants emphasize the importance of determination, effective study habits, and self-education, arguing that innate ability is not the sole determinant of success in engineering. They also highlight the long-term stability of an engineering career compared to the uncertainties of professional sports.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of mechanical engineering fundamentals
  • Basic knowledge of effective study techniques
  • Familiarity with academic performance metrics (e.g., IQ scores, grades)
  • Awareness of career paths in sports versus engineering
NEXT STEPS
  • Research effective study techniques for engineering subjects
  • Explore resources for self-studying physics, such as Halliday Resnick's "University Physics"
  • Investigate the engineering programs at reputable institutions like IISCER and IISC
  • Learn about time management strategies for academic success
USEFUL FOR

High school students considering engineering careers, educators seeking to support students with diverse learning needs, and individuals interested in the balance between talent and hard work in career choices.

  • #31
Fervent Freyja said:
I find it hard to believe your IQ was measured at 80, someone scoring 75 would have difficulty passing the 6th grade. It must be higher than that. See: http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Mild+mental+retardation

The score means nothing, it isn't measuring anything.

Anyway, IQ testing is administered by a professional, I wouldn't trust any online testing. It's real purpose is to be able to identify vulnerable children (both disabled and gifted) and serves as evidence or paperwork that educators and healthcare professionals need in order to find care the child needs. Outside of that, it doesn't mean much.

IQ tests aren't, or shouldn't, be used to identify "gifted children" - simply because they can't do that.

They shouldn't exist at all, but I digress.

Have you been screened for Asperger's Syndrome? It has been removed from the DSM, but the symptoms, usually caused by social factors, are being treated. They are very talented in some areas (like engineering), but can fall behind academically if not given the support needed. You do realize you are being bullied for no reason? There are plenty of other students that do worse!

Design a machine that shoves footballs up their... and don't care about what they say!

Asperger's was removed from the DSM, as well as autism, and replaced with autism spectrum disorder. It was also one of the most self diagnosed disorders in the DSM, even though medically it was rare. Further, he plays football, Asperger's he does not have.

I'm not sure why this was even brought up.
 
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  • #32
Fervent Freyja said:
I find it hard to believe your IQ was measured at 80, someone scoring 75 would have difficulty passing the 6th grade. It must be higher than that. See: http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Mild+mental+retardation

Anyway, IQ testing is administered by a professional, I wouldn't trust any online testing. It's real purpose is to be able to identify vulnerable children (both disabled and gifted) and serves as evidence or paperwork that educators and healthcare professionals need in order to find care the child needs. Outside of that, it doesn't mean much. Have you been screened for Asperger's Syndrome? It has been removed from the DSM, but the symptoms, usually caused by social factors, are being treated. They are very talented in some areas (like engineering), but can fall behind academically if not given the support needed. You do realize you are being bullied for no reason? There are plenty of other students that do worse!

Design a machine that shoves footballs up their... and don't care about what they say!
oh...okay,if that is the case then i think the online iq tests are totally faulty...
well actually my trajectory is a little bit similar to sine function wave

you know like ups and downs ( in overall percentage or grade)
In 7th class i scored 75% with little effort(thats a B grade) like 1 hour study at home
in 8th class i scored 86 % with more effort(thats an A grade) 2 hours study at home
in 9th class i scored 64% with little more effort(thats a B- grade) then class 8th. 2 hours study at home
in 10th class i scored 76% (B grade)...since i was disappointed by my score in 9th class therefore i had put reasonable effort...3 hours study at home
in 11th class i again scored 62% (B- grade) with a little more effort then 10th class
i think its same as sine function wave...maybe i should just work more harder now.Right?
 
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  • #33
Fervent Freyja said:
I find it hard to believe your IQ was measured at 80, someone scoring 75 would have difficulty passing the 6th grade. It must be higher than that. See: http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Mild+mental+retardation

Anyway, IQ testing is administered by a professional, I wouldn't trust any online testing. It's real purpose is to be able to identify vulnerable children (both disabled and gifted) and serves as evidence or paperwork that educators and healthcare professionals need in order to find care the child needs. Outside of that, it doesn't mean much. Have you been screened for Asperger's Syndrome? It has been removed from the DSM, but the symptoms, usually caused by social factors, are being treated. They are very talented in some areas (like engineering), but can fall behind academically if not given the support needed. You do realize you are being bullied for no reason? There are plenty of other students that do worse!

Design a machine that shoves footballs up their... and don't care about what they say!

yes i do think my classmates were bullying me...but my coach also said that i should better become footballer
but actually my friends and math teacher says i can be a good engineer!

well you know its human nature to believe more in negative/bad things rather then positive and good things...so maybe due to that instinct,i believed bad advice(to become footballer regardless of my passion)...but after all your answers and advices my friends.I think i should believe in myself and work hard to become a good engineer. :) thanks

Student100 said:
The score means nothing, it isn't measuring anything.
IQ tests aren't, or shouldn't, be used to identify "gifted children" - simply because they can't do that.

They shouldn't exist at all, but I digress.
Asperger's was removed from the DSM, as well as autism, and replaced with autism spectrum disorder. It was also one of the most self diagnosed disorders in the DSM, even though medically it was rare. Further, he plays football, Asperger's he does not have.

I'm not sure why this was even brought up.

Yes you are right sir.Now i think iq tests are totally wrong and useless
 
  • #34
ultimater said:
.but after all your answers and advices my friends.I think i should believe in myself and work hard to become a good engineer. :) thanks

That is what you must do.

I studied very hard for the Finnish national entrance exam for technology-field for applied sciences universities. I did pass. But I selfstudied every day for 4-8 hrs. I studied maybe two months, which was a little bit too short time. But my score was good enough to pass the test so I was happy. I had three subjects to study and refresh old knowledge. I studied chemistry physics and mathematics from high school level books. The science was not totally difficult, but I did not have very much time to study both mathematics and physics for 2 month period. Especially the physics part was a little tough in short time.
  1. You need to begin studying well in advance, of the exam (if you study for engineer exam?)
  2. try to plan your studying in calendar etc...
  3. Sleep well (8-10hrs) Sleep is important for young people.
  4. eat healthy and have regular intervals between meals
  5. physical exercise every day 2-3h (unless you are sick)
  6. have a relaxing hobby maybe 1-3h per each week.
  7. study hard every day (unless you are too sick, don't vomit on your schoolbooks!)
  8. it helps a little bit, if you don't need to work while you are studying for entrance exam. (but if you start studying earlier, in a focused and pre-planned manner, then it should not be so bad, if you also work at the same time. (try to work reduced work hours if possible)
 
  • #35
Student100 said:
The score means nothing, it isn't measuring anything.

Did I not say that it was meaningless beyond a few conditions? What are you talking about? By definition, a score is a measurement, so calling it a 'score that doesn't measure anything' is misusing the terminology here.
IQ tests aren't, or shouldn't, be used to identify "gifted children" - simply because they can't do that.

They shouldn't exist at all, but I digress.

Yes, from what I recall in completing mock IEPs, IQ scores can be used as an evaluative tool in US public education; though, maybe that has changed in the last decade. They are sometimes a prerequisite for entrance to some exceptional programs- look it up yourself. I would only request one of these if a student was not doing the coursework and didn’t have the grades to reflect that they are eligible for a program, or as additional evidence that a disabled child qualifies for an exceptional program. It is a matter of paperwork. They are often also used to prove that a child has a disability to the government so that they can receive financial benefits, medical assistance and the educational support that they very much need. It is difficult to prove cognitive disability, what else do you suggest? You cannot just snap your fingers on these matters. I did not state that I agree with using IQ testing beyond those few conditions.
Further, he plays football, Asperger's he does not have.

Are you stating that no person with Asperger's has ever played football? Do you have any evidence for this?
I'm not sure why this was even brought up.
Because, this young was made to feel stupid and I was trying to make him feel better, unlike some other meanies on here. It should be pointed out is that he is probably being bullied before any other advice is given!
 
  • #36
I don't think IQ tests are completely meaningless, I think the results just need to be taken with a grain of salt. They can be useful in identifying a students strengths and weaknesses, but may miss the bigger picture. But that is why people have been redesigning the different tests in order to make them better.

As for apergers (not commenting about the OP at all, just saying in general), while the diagnosis does not exist anymore, it is very harmful to make such blanket statements about those who suffer from symptoms (now associated with being on the high functioning end of the autism spectrum). While these people may begin with poor social skills, by the time they are teenagers they often have adjusted so well that one may not even know that they are on the spectrum (even though they are aware that they have to make a lot of effort to socialize) and would be able to comfortably participate in sports. I have often suspected that several of the smartest, most accomplished people that I know may have some symptoms of the disorder, which could very well have contributed to their success (intense focus etc.)
 
  • #37
Hey ultimater.

I think you should realize that there are probably a number of reasons why things don't come to you academically/intellectually and this doesn't reflect incapacitation (i.e. the inability to do a task). This is quite common and the way around it is finding out how you think/work internally and how that can be utilized to bridge between what others think/work who are providing teaching and guidance.

If it involves language then it means you will have to find your own "native" language to understand things and get teachers and other resources to bridge what is being communicated in whatever language to you in yours.

Everyone has their own language that they work in and once it clicks in that language it usually stays. It's almost like everyone having their own dialect of some language and when it's difficult to translate then they feel they are stupid when in reality they just haven't found the right translation to use.

If you are able to communicate a vast range of concepts, information, and assumptions and break things down in regular conversation then that is evidence that you can acquire understanding in many forms. Even if you are limited relative to others, it doesn't imply incapacitation.
 
  • #38
chiro said:
Even if you are limited relative to others, it doesn't imply incapacitation.
It only implies a different, perhaps more effective, way of looking at things. That's often called creativity, very useful to have in an Engineering field! So is your demonstrated curiosity of how things work.
 
  • #39
Fervent Freyja said:
Did I not say that it was meaningless beyond a few conditions? What are you talking about? By definition, a score is a measurement, so calling it a 'score that doesn't measure anything' is misusing the terminology here.

A score is a measurement? Except it isn't at all when it's applied to things it can't measure. Intelligence can't be defined or quantified, so there are no tests that can actually "score" it.
Yes, from what I recall in completing mock IEPs, IQ scores can be used as an evaluative tool in US public education; though, maybe that has changed in the last decade. They are sometimes a prerequisite for entrance to some exceptional programs- look it up yourself. I would only request one of these if a student was not doing the coursework and didn’t have the grades to reflect that they are eligible for a program, or as additional evidence that a disabled child qualifies for an exceptional program. It is a matter of paperwork. They are often also used to prove that a child has a disability to the government so that they can receive financial benefits, medical assistance and the educational support that they very much need. It is difficult to prove cognitive disability, what else do you suggest? You cannot just snap your fingers on these matters. I did not state that I agree with using IQ testing beyond those few conditions.

IQ tests, as far as I know, are never used as the sole determination of disabled or gifted children. For the latter, they're seldom used at all.

What else do I suggest? What educators already do, look at the whole person in context.
Are you stating that no person with Asperger's has ever played football? Do you have any evidence for this?

Considering when Hans Asperger first coined his syndrome, a common characteristic was clumsiness and poor motor skills- than yes, I would consider it highly unlikely anyone with Asperger would play football well enough that a coach would tell you to pursue it professionally.

Further, Asperger's no longer exists, was replaced with autism spectrum disorder, and again, I'm not sure why this was brought up.

Because, this young was made to feel stupid and I was trying to make him feel better, unlike some other meanies on here. It should be pointed out is that he is probably being bullied before any other advice is given!

Who was trying to make him feel stupid? His educators gave their opinion and advice, I don't see any bullying there.

Making him feel better isn't giving him proper educational advice- the entire purpose of this thread. No one is being mean here.

He has the desire to do something, which is half the battle, the other half is applying yourself. If he can't apply himself to his academics (as evidenced by his poor marks), then he needs to find another career path. It isn't too late for him to try though. His "IQ" score is meaningless and has only served the purpose of derailing the thread.
 
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