Perfect numbers beside 6 in mod6.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of perfect numbers, particularly focusing on their behavior under modulo 6 arithmetic. Participants explore conjectures regarding the congruence of even perfect numbers greater than 6 and the implications of the existence of odd perfect numbers.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants observe that all checked even perfect numbers are congruent to 4 modulo 6 and propose this as a conjecture for all even perfect numbers greater than 6.
  • There is a suggestion that if an odd perfect number exists, its modulo 6 value would differ from that of even perfect numbers.
  • Participants discuss the form of even perfect numbers, specifically that they can be expressed as 2^(n - 1) * (2^n - 1) where n is prime, and explore implications for their behavior modulo 3.
  • One participant questions the reasoning behind certain congruences and suggests that the calculations should focus on modulo 2 instead of modulo 3.
  • Another participant asserts that 4^n is congruent to 4 modulo 6 and provides a proof involving the alternating forms of powers of 2 modulo 6.
  • There is a challenge regarding the interpretation of calculations involving expressions like 2^(2n-1) - 2^(n-1) + 2 in the context of modulo 3.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the properties of perfect numbers and their congruences, particularly regarding the modulo 6 behavior of even perfect numbers and the implications of odd perfect numbers. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives.

Contextual Notes

Some calculations and assertions depend on specific properties of prime numbers and congruences, which may not be universally accepted or proven within the discussion. There are also unresolved questions regarding the validity of certain mathematical steps and interpretations.

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i chekced a few perfect numbers with module 6 and, a nice property is that all mod 6 equal 4 (at least for those i checked), i guees that if an odd perfect number would exist then its mod 6 would be different.

i wonder how to prove that for every even perfect number greater than 6, its mod 6 equal 4?

i guess because its even it's divisble by 2, and then the question becomes how to prove that mod 3 equal 2, then how do you prove/disprove the assertion?
 
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loop quantum gravity said:
i guees that if an odd perfect number would exist then its mod 6 would be different.

obviously: any number congruent to 0,2,4 mod 6 is even.

it seems an interesting conjecture.
 
All even perfect numbers are of the form 2^(n - 1) * (2^n - 1) where n is prime, so if we restrict our attention to the case where n > 2, we see that

2^(n - 1) * (2^n - 1) = (-1)^(n - 1) * ((-1)^n - 1) = 1(-1 -1) = 1 (mod 3)

since n - 1 is even and n is odd.
 
loop quantum gravity said:
i guess because its even it's divisble by 2, and then the question becomes how to prove that mod 3 equal 1, then how do you prove/disprove the assertion?

Small correction bolded.

http://primes.utm.edu/notes/proofs/EvenPerfect.html for a proof of Muzza's statement about even perfect numbers if you haven't seen one yet (in most elementary texts as well).
 
Muzza said:
All even perfect numbers are of the form 2^(n - 1) * (2^n - 1) where n is prime, so if we restrict our attention to the case where n > 2, we see that

2^(n - 1) * (2^n - 1) = (-1)^(n - 1) * ((-1)^n - 1) = 1(-1 -1) = 1 (mod 3)

since n - 1 is even and n is odd.
muzza, why this "2^(n - 1) * (2^n - 1) = (-1)^(n - 1) * ((-1)^n - 1)"?
or you were referring to conguerence here, and even if you did refer to conguernece shouldn't it be mod2
because:
2^(2n-1)-2^(n-1)-(-1)^(2n-1)-(-1)^n=2^(2n-1)-2^(n-1)+(-1)^2n+(-1)^(n+1)=2^(2n-1)-2^(n-1)+2=0mod2
 
All the calculations were made modulo 3, as indicated by the "(mod 3)" at the end of the line.

Why would you be interested in working modulo 2 when you want to prove that something is equal to something else modulo 3...?
 
then how do you infer that: 2^(2n-1)-2^(n-1)+2 is mod3.
 
[tex]2 \equiv -1~~ (mod~3)~~\implies~2^a \equiv -1^a~~(mod~3)[/tex]
 
loop quantum gravity said:
i wonder how to prove that for every even perfect number greater than 6, its mod 6 equal 4?
There must be a much nicer way to do this ...

First I assert that [itex]4^n \equiv 4~(mod~6)[/itex] ---(1)

Proof (1): (whenever I've missed it, everything that follows is a congruence mod 6)

[tex]4^n \equiv (-2)^n = (-1)^n \cdot 2^n[/tex]

Since 2^n is not divisible by 6, 2^n = 6m+2 or 6m+4. Next, notice that no two consecutive powers of 2 can take the same form, for then we'd have :

[tex]2^n = 2^{n+1} - 2^n = (6m'+2) - (6m+2) = 6q~[/tex], which is not possible (and likewise with the form 6m+4).

This shows that 2^n must alternate between the above two forms. In other words, modulo 6, 2^n must alternate between 4 and -4. Since [itex]2^1 \equiv -4~(mod~6)[/itex], we have [itex]2^n \equiv (-1)^n\cdot 4~(mod~6)[/itex] and hence [itex](-1)^n\cdot 2^n \equiv 4 ~(mod~6)[/itex]

This proves assertion 1.

Next we simply note that an even perfect number can be written as

[tex]P = 2^{p-1} \cdot(2^p-1)[/tex]

For odd p > 2, we write p=2n+1, which gives

[tex]P = 2^{2n} \cdot (2^{2n+1} -1 ) = 4^n (2\cdot 4^n -1) \equiv 4(4\cdot2-1) \equiv 4[/tex]
 
Last edited:
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then how do you infer that: 2^(2n-1)-2^(n-1)+2 is mod3.

Huh? 2^(2n-1)-2^(n-1)+2 is a number, one can perform calculations with it modulo 3 without needing to know that the number itself "is mod 3" (which makes no sense anyway...).
 

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