Prove Schwarz's & Triangle Ineqs for Inf Seqs: Abs Conv

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    Absolute Convergence
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around proving the Schwarz's and triangle inequalities for infinite sequences, specifically focusing on the absolute convergence of the series formed by the products of two sequences. Participants explore the necessary conditions and implications of the inequalities in the context of infinite sums.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that to show absolute convergence, it may be necessary to know that the terms |a_n| are bounded rather than just the sum of squares being finite.
  • Another participant argues that the Schwarz inequality is not needed to establish absolute convergence, proposing instead to use the inequality \(2|a_nb_n| \leq |a_n|^2 + |b_n|^2\) for the proof.
  • A similar point is reiterated by another participant, emphasizing the use of the inequality for finite sums before taking the limit.
  • There is a question raised about whether \( |a_nb_n|^2 \) should be considered in the context of the inequalities discussed.
  • One participant confirms that \( |a_nb_n|^2 \) will be summable, but asserts that the goal is to show that \( |a_nb_n| \) is summable, challenging the previous claims.
  • Another participant presents an inequality involving \( |a_n - b_n|^2 \) and derives a relationship between the sums of squares of the sequences and the product terms, leading to a conclusion about the summability of \( |a_nb_n| \).
  • A participant attempts to show a relationship involving the squared sum of the series and asks for clarification on whether the equality or inequality holds in a specific context.
  • Another participant responds that the latter inequality is correct and suggests that the former equality holds under certain conditions, specifically if a constant exists such that \( a_n = \lambda b_n \) for each \( n \).

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the necessity of the Schwarz inequality for proving absolute convergence, with some advocating for its use while others propose alternative approaches. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best method to prove the inequalities in the context of infinite sequences.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not reached a consensus on the assumptions required for the proofs, particularly regarding the boundedness of the sequences and the conditions under which the inequalities hold. There are also unresolved mathematical steps related to the summability of the product terms.

Dustinsfl
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Prove the Schwarz's and the triangle inequalities for infinite sequences:
If
$$
\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_n|^2 < \infty\quad\text{and}\quad
\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|b_n|^2 < \infty
$$
then
$\sum\limits_{n = -\infty}^{\infty} a_nb_n$ converges absolutely.

To show this, wouldn't I need to know that the |a_n| is bounded not the sum of squares?
 
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To see the series is absolutely convergent doesn't need Schwarz inequality, just write that $2|a_nb_n|\leq |a_n|^2+|b_n|^2$.

But we can use Schwarz inequality to get an estimation of the sum, using it first for finite sums, then taking the limit.
 
girdav said:
To see the series is absolutely convergent doesn't need Schwarz inequality, just write that $2|a_nb_n|\leq |a_n|^2+|b_n|^2$.

But we can use Schwarz inequality to get an estimation of the sum, using it first for finite sums, then taking the limit.

Should $|a_nb_n|^2$?
 
Where?
 
girdav said:
Where?

In your post.
 
Indeed, $|a_nb_n|^2$ will be summable, but here we show more (that $|a_nb_n|$ is summable). I think the inequality I wrote as stated. Did you try to show it and use it?
 
We have that $|a_n - b_n|^2 \leq |a_n|^2 + |b_n|^2 - 2|a_nb_n| \geq 0$, i.e. $|a_n|^2 + |b_n|^2 \geq 2|a_nb_n|$.
Let $\sum\limits_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_n|^2 = \alpha < \infty$ and $\sum\limits_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|b_n|^2 = \beta < \infty$.
Then
$$
\alpha + \beta \geq 2\sum\limits_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_nb_n|\iff \sum\limits_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_nb_n|\leq\frac{\alpha + \beta}{2} < \infty.
$$
 
Now I am trying to show this for the same problem.
$$
\left|\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}a_nb_n\right|^2\leq \left(\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_n|^2\right)\left(\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|b_n|^2\right)
$$$$
\left|\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}a_nb_n\right|^2\leq\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_nb_n|^2
$$

Is it this
$$
\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_nb_n|^2 = \sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_n|^2\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|b_n|^2
$$
or
$$
\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_nb_n|^2 \leq \sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|a_n|^2\sum_{n = -\infty}^{\infty}|b_n|^2
$$
 
Last edited:
The latter (actually, a nice exercise is to show that we have the former if and only if we can find a constant $\lambda$ such that for each $n$, $a_n=\lambda b_n$.
 

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