Prove what the exterior derivative of a 3-form is....

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around proving a specific property of the exterior derivative of a 3-form in the context of differential geometry, particularly involving vector fields on a smooth manifold. Participants explore various aspects of the exterior derivative, including its definitions and implications, while addressing the treatment of Lie brackets and their relation to forms.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant attempts to prove the relation $$3d\sigma (X,Y,Z)=-\sigma ([X,Y],Z)$$ and expresses confusion about how to handle the Lie bracket within the context of a 2-form.
  • Another participant clarifies that the Lie bracket results in a vector field rather than a wedge product, providing a specific formulation for the Lie bracket and its application to the 2-form.
  • A later post mentions that the initial poster forgot to specify the types of vector fields involved, noting that $$X,Y\in V_K(M)$$ and $$Z\in V(M)$$, indicating their relationship to the characteristic distribution of the 2-form.
  • One participant introduces an alternative definition of the exterior derivative, outlining its application to functions, 1-forms, and 2-forms, suggesting it might be easier to work with.
  • Another participant provides computations for 1-forms to illustrate how the alternative definition of the exterior derivative interacts with the Lie bracket, emphasizing the importance of the Lie bracket term in maintaining the properties of the exterior derivative.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the treatment of the Lie bracket and its implications for the exterior derivative. There is no consensus on a single approach or resolution to the initial proof attempt, as multiple perspectives and definitions are presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the complexity of the definitions and the need for careful treatment of vector fields and forms, particularly regarding the assumptions about the types of vector fields involved and the implications of the Lie bracket in the context of exterior derivatives.

Fgard
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I am trying to prove the following:
$$3d\sigma (X,Y,Z)=-\sigma ([X,Y],Z)$$
where ##X,Y,Z\in\mathscr{X}(M)## with M as a smooth manifold. I can start by stating what I know so it is easier to see what I do wrong for you guys.

I know that a general 2-form has the form:
##\omega=\omega_{ij}dx^i\land dy^j##. if one "puts" in two vector fields, ##X=X^{\mu}\frac{\partial}{\partial X^{\mu}}## and ##Y=Y^{\nu}\frac{\partial}{\partial X^{\nu}}## one gets

$$\omega(X,Y)=\omega_{\alpha\beta} Y^{\nu}\frac{\partial}{\partial X^{\nu}}X^{\mu}\frac{\partial}{\partial X^{\mu}}dx^{\alpha}\land dy^{\beta} =\omega_{\alpha\beta} (Y^{\beta}X^{\alpha}-Y^{\alpha}X^{\beta})$$

One of my problems is that I don't know how to treat the lie bracket inside the 2-form. Specifically the corresponding wedge that it should yield. This is what my efforts have gotten me so far:

$$-\sigma ([X,Y],Z)=-\sigma_{\alpha\beta}(X^{\nu}Y^{\mu}\frac{\partial^2}{\partial X^{\nu}X^{\mu}}-Y^{\mu}X^{\nu}\frac{\partial^2}{\partial X^{\nu}X^{\mu}})d(XY)^{\alpha} \land dz^{\beta} $$

This doesn't get me anywhere, so my conclusion is that I am messing it up some where. (I know by the way that there is a formula that you can use, but I want to understand what it does that is why I am trying this. )
 
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Fgard said:
One of my problems is that I don't know how to treat the lie bracket inside the 2-form. Specifically the corresponding wedge that it should yield.
A Lie bracket does not yield a wedge. It yields a vector field. Thus we have
$$[X,Y]\equiv \left(X^j\partial_jY^k-Y^j\partial_jX^k\right)\partial _k$$
So if \sigma is a 2-form and we write T\equiv[X,Y], we have
$$-\sigma([X,Y],Z)=-\sigma(T,Z)=-\sigma_{ab}dx^a\wedge dx^b(T,Z)=-\sigma_{ab} (Z^{\beta}T^a-Z^{\alpha}T^b)$$
$$\ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ =-\sigma_{ab} \left(Z^{b}\left(X^j\partial_jY^a-Y^j\partial_jX^a\right)-Z^{a}\left(X^j\partial_jY^b-Y^j\partial_jX^b\right)\right)$$

By the way, I recommend against writing basis vectors as ##\frac{\partial}{\partial X^\mu}## because the capital ##X## is used to denote a specific vector and the basis vector has nothing to do with that vector. I like to use ##\partial_\mu## because it's clear, quick to write and say but another option is ##\frac{\partial}{\partial x^\mu}## (note the lower case ##x##).
 
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Thanks for your help andrewkirk, it cleared up my confusion with the Lie bracket. I see now that i forgot to mention in my initial post that:
$$X,Y\in V_K(M)$$ and $$Z\in V(M)$$
With K as the characteristic distribution of ##\sigma## and X,Y are tangent to this distribution.
 
There is an alternative definition of the exterior derivative that you might find easier to work with.

For functions ##df(X) = X.f##
For 1 forms ##2dσ(X,Y) = X.σ(Y)-Y.σ(X) -σ([X,Y])##
For two forms ##3dσ(X,Y,Z) = X.σ(Y,Z) - Y.σ(X,Z) + Z.σ(X,Y) - σ([X,Y],Z) + σ([X,Z],Y) - σ([Y,Z],X) ##

The formula generalizes to n-forms.
 
Last edited:
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To get a feel for this definition of exterior derivative, and how the Lie bracket works in it, here are some computations for 1 forms.

First, if ##σ = df## for some function ##f## then ##2dσ(X,Y)## becomes ##X.Y.f-Y.X.f -[X,Y].f## This is zero by definition of the Lie bracket. So ##d^2f = 0 ## as required.

Next notice that as a function of ##X## and ##Y##, ##X.σ(Y)-Y.σ(X)## without the Lie bracket term is not a 2 form. It is anti-commutative and linear over constants but if one multiplies ##X## by a function ##f##, one gets

##fXσ(Y) - Y.σ(fX) = fX.σ(Y) - (Y.f)σ(X) -fY.σ(X)## by the Leibniz rule. So this expression depends on the derivative of ##f##.

The third term in the definition of ##dσ## fixes this. The identity ##[fX,Y] = -(Y.f)X + f[X,Y]## gives

##σ([fX,Y]) = -(Y.f)σ(X) + fσ([X,Y])## so subtracting this cancels the problematic term in ##Y.f## and what is left is

##fXσ(Y) -fY.σ(X) - fσ([X,Y]) = fdσ(X,Y)##

If you have the patience, check that ##d^2 = 0## on 1 forms.
 
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