Proving inequalities using calculus

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around proving inequalities using calculus, specifically focusing on the integral of the function \( \frac{1}{t} \) over certain intervals. Participants explore various approaches and techniques to establish these inequalities without relying on logarithmic functions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes proving the inequality \( \int_1^2 \frac{1}{t}\ dt < 1 < \int_1^3 \frac{1}{t}\ dt \) to conclude that \( 2 < e < 3 \), suggesting no use of logarithms.
  • Another participant attempts to justify the first part of the inequality using a graphical approach, comparing the area under \( \frac{1}{t} \) to the area under the constant function \( 1 \) on the interval \( [1, 2] \).
  • Jensen's inequality is introduced by a participant, who argues that since \( \frac{1}{t} \) is strictly convex, it can be applied to show that \( 1 < \int_1^3 \frac{1}{t}\ dt \).
  • Some participants discuss the use of Riemann sums to approximate the integral, with varying levels of confidence in their setups and calculations.
  • There are corrections regarding the use of left and right Riemann sums, with participants clarifying the implications of overestimating or underestimating the integral.
  • One participant shares additional inequalities that could potentially be proven using calculus, inviting further exploration of these topics.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints and approaches to proving the inequalities, but there is no consensus on the correctness of the methods or the final conclusions. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing ideas and techniques presented.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about their setups and calculations, particularly regarding the application of Riemann sums and the assumptions made in their proofs. There are also mentions of potential typos and the need for further justification in their arguments.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying calculus, particularly in the context of inequalities and integral approximations, as well as to individuals looking for examples of mathematical reasoning and proof techniques.

Poly1
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This might sound an odd/inappropriate request, but could someone post some inequalities that can be proven using calculus?
 
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here's one you can try.

prove:

$$\int_1^2 \frac{1}{t}\ dt < 1 < \int_1^3 \frac{1}{t}\ dt$$

to conclude that $2 < e < 3$.

oh, and...no fair using logarithms (pretend you've never heard of them).
 
Deveno said:
here's one you can try.

prove:

$$\int_1^2 \frac{1}{t}\ dt < 1 < \int_1^3 \frac{1}{t}\ dt$$

to conclude that $2 < e < 3$.

oh, and...no fair using logarithms (pretend you've never heard of them).

Is this right for the first part of the inequality? Drawing the graph of $y = \frac{1}{t}$ and $y = 1$ on the interval $t \in [1, 2]$ we see that $\int_{1}^{2}\frac{1}{t} \ dt < \int_{1}^{2}\ dt = 1$ (I posted a diagram but it wasn't rendering well). For the second part, I found the following online:

Jensen's inequality: Let $f(x)$ be a convex function on $[a, b]$. Then $f\left(\frac{a+b}{2}\right) \le \frac{1}{b-a}\int_{a}^{b}f(x)\ dx$.

It also said that in the case where the function strictly convex we have $<$ rather than $\le$.

Let $f(t) = \frac{1}{t}$. Then $\displaystyle f''(t) = \frac{2}{t^3} > 0$ for $t\in\mathbb{R}^+$. Therefore $f(t)$ is strictly convex on $[1, 3]$.

$ \displaystyle \frac{2}{3+1} < \frac{1}{3-1}\int_{1}^{3}\frac{1}{t}\ dt \implies \frac{1}{2} < \frac{1}{2} \int_{1}^{3} \frac{1}{t} \ dt \implies 1 < \int_{1}^{3} \frac{1}{t} \ dt.$ Did I get that right?
 
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I'll try to prove the result that I've used. (Thinking)
 
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You might also think in terms of a Riemann sum definition of the definite integral.
 
Poly said:
$ \displaystyle \frac{2}{3+1} < \frac{1}{3-1}\int_{1}^{3}f(t)\ dt \implies \frac{1}{2} = \frac{1}{2} \int_{1}^{3} \frac{1}{t} \ dt \implies 1 < \int_{1}^{3} \frac{1}{t} \ dt.$ Did I get that right?

You have a small typo but this part looks right if you replace an "=" with "<" in one place.

$ \displaystyle \frac{2}{3+1} < \frac{1}{3-1}\int_{1}^{3}f(t)\ dt \implies \frac{1}{2} < \frac{1}{2} \int_{1}^{3} \frac{1}{t} \ dt \implies 1 < \int_{1}^{3} \frac{1}{t} \ dt.$
 
Thanks, guys.

MarkFL said:
You might also think in terms of a Riemann sum definition of the definite integral.
I get $\displaystyle \int_{1}^{3}\frac{1}{t} \ dt = \lim_{n\to\infty}2\sum_{i=1}^{n}\frac{1}{n+2i}$ I'm not too sure what to do next, though.

My guess is this is greater than $ \displaystyle 2\sum_{i=1}^{7}\frac{1}{7+2i} > 1$ but I really don't know. (Thinking)
 
I think there's a problem with your setup in the above post, Poly. In the final summation you have $n=7$ which is using 7 sub-intervals to approximate the area (assuming the other part is correct, which I don't think it is). You need to find the sum, just as you wrote before, for $n \rightarrow \infty$.

The way to calculate a definite integral using Riemann sums is by the following:

[math]\int_{a}^{b}f(x)dx=\lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} \sum_{k=1}^{n}f(x_k) \Delta x[/math], where [math]\Delta x = \frac{b-a}{n}[/math] and $x_k=a+k\Delta x$.

So for your problem I believe (but am not 100% sure) that the setup is as follows:

For [math]f(t)=\frac{1}{t}[/math], [math]\int_{1}^{3} \frac{1}{t}dt=\lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} \sum_{k=1}^{n} f \left( 1+\frac{2k}{n} \right) \left( \frac{2}{n} \right)[/math]

This is where I'll stop and let someone else confirm. Maybe this is where MarkFL was going with his suggestion.
 
Okay, I thought I was meant to approximate the area and show that it goes over $1$. (Doh)

I think your set-up and mine are the same since $\displaystyle f(t) = \frac{1}{t}$ therefore $\displaystyle f \left( 1+\frac{2k}{n}\right) = \frac{1}{1+\frac{2k}{n}}.$

I simplified but didn't say so. Sorry about the confusion.
 
  • #10
Poly said:
Okay, I thought I was meant to approximate the area and show that it goes over $1$. (Doh)

I think your set-up and mine are the same since $\displaystyle f(t) = \frac{1}{t}$ therefore $\displaystyle f \left( 1+\frac{2k}{n}\right) = \frac{1}{1+\frac{2k}{n}}.$

Hmm, let me continue to simplify that. You might be right!

[math]\frac{1}{1+\frac{2k}{n}}=\frac{1}{\frac{n+2k}{n}}=\frac{n}{n+2k}[/math]

So now we take [math]\left( \frac{n}{n+2k} \right) \left( \frac{2}{n} \right)=\frac{2}{n+2k}[/math]

Ok, it seems you were correct with the set up! My apologies. Since I didn't see your work and the simplified form is hard to see without doing the work, I assumed incorrectly (Blush).

I don't think taking 7 sub-intervals is enough unless you also show that the approximation using 7 sub-intervals is larger than the true area, which opens up another thing to justify!
 
  • #11
Sorry, yes, I should have posted the steps to avoid confusion.

You're right I didn't think through my 7 sub intervals guess (Rofl)
 
  • #12
I was reading the wiki article on Riemann sums and it says

The left Riemann sum amounts to an overestimation if f is monotonically decreasing on this interval, and an underestimation if it is monotonically increasing.


We're using a left Riemann sum, so our sum can never exceed the true value? If we manually calculate the sum of the first 7 sub intervals (and this is indeed greater than 1 according to wolfram), wouldn't that be enough?
 
  • #13
By the way, I enjoyed that question. Thanks guys.

Does anyone know more inequalities that be proven with calculus?

I found two that look like they could use some calculus (Rofl)

1. $x(1+x)^{-1} < \ln(1+x) < x$ where $-1 < x, \ x \ne 0$.

2. $\alpha (x-1) < x^{\alpha}-1 < \alpha x^{\alpha-1}(x-1)$ where $1 < x, \ 1 < \alpha$

Not sure what to differentiate or integrate though. (Thinking)
 
  • #14
Jameson said:
...
This is where I'll stop and let someone else confirm. Maybe this is where MarkFL was going with his suggestion.

Yes, exactly.

Consider the left sum:

$\displaystyle \int_1^a\frac{1}{t}\,dt=\lim_{n\to\infty}\left[\sum_{k=0}^{n-1}\left(f(t_k)\Delta t \right) \right]$

where:

$\displaystyle \Delta t=\frac{a-1}{n}$

$\displaystyle t_k=1+k\Delta t=1+k\frac{a-1}{n}=\frac{n+(a-1)k}{n}$

and so:

$\displaystyle \int_1^a\frac{1}{t}\,dt=(a-1)\lim_{n\to\infty}\left(\sum_{k=0}^{n-1}\frac{1}{n+(a-1)k} \right)$

However, now that I look at it, this is only useful to show that:

$\displaystyle \int_1^2\frac{1}{t}\,dt<\int_1^3\frac{1}{t}\,dt$

Let's take a look at this from a differential equations perspective:

$\displaystyle x(y)=\int_1^y\frac{1}{t}\,dt$

Differentiate with respect to y:

$\displaystyle \frac{dx}{dy}=\frac{1}{y}$

Inverting both sides, we now have the IVP:

$\displaystyle \frac{dy}{dx}=y$ where $\displaystyle y(0)=1$

Euler's method gives rise to the recursion:

$\displaystyle y_{n+1}=\left(1+\frac{x_n}{n} \right)^n$

and so:

$\displaystyle y=\lim_{n\to\infty}y_{n+1}=e^{x}$

Then, we may write:

$\displaystyle x=\int_1^{e^x}\frac{1}{t}\,dt$

Hence, the inequality becomes:

$\displaystyle \int_1^{2}\frac{1}{t}\,dt<\int_1^{e}\frac{1}{t}\,dt<\int_1^{3}\frac{1}{t}\,dt$

Since $\displaystyle \frac{1}{t}>0$ where $\displaystyle t\in[1,\infty)$ then it follows that:

$\displaystyle 2<e<3$

edit: Now that I review this, I have not shown the inequality is true, I have assumed it to be true. (Worried)
 
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  • #15
if you are summing over k = 0 to 6, that is a "left-hand sum" (over-estimate).

you are actually using "right-hand sums" (k = 1 to 7), which are under-estimates. this is good, since this means the actual sum (the integral) is larger, which is what you WANT.
 
  • #16
Deveno said:
if you are summing over k = 0 to 6, that is a "left-hand sum" (over-estimate).

you are actually using "right-hand sums" (k = 1 to 7), which are under-estimates. this is good, since this means the actual sum (the integral) is larger, which is what you WANT.
Oh I see I mixed the two up. Do you have another delicious question perhaps? (Thinking)
 

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