Proving There Does Not Exist a Continuous Function

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around proving that there does not exist a continuous, bijective function from the interval [0,1) to the real numbers. Participants are exploring the implications of continuity and the Intermediate Value Theorem (IVT) in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are considering the use of contradiction by assuming the existence of such a function and applying the IVT. There are discussions about the behavior of the function on subintervals and the implications of it being bijective.

Discussion Status

There is an active exploration of ideas, with some participants questioning the assumptions about the function's behavior and others suggesting visualizing the function to clarify its properties. Guidance has been offered regarding the implications of continuity and bijection, but no consensus has been reached.

Contextual Notes

Participants are grappling with the definitions and properties of continuous functions, particularly in relation to the IVT and the nature of bijective mappings. There is an acknowledgment of the need to consider the behavior of the function at specific points and intervals.

Lee33
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Homework Statement



Prove that there does not exist a continuous, bijective function ##f:[0,1)\to \mathbb{R}.##

2. The attempt at a solution

I am stumped on how to do this question. What I was thinking of doing was assume that there is a function and arrive at a contradiction, in doing so I know I need to use the IVT since ##f## is assumed to be continuous, but I can't create such a contradiction.
 
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Theorem:
Let be f : A \subset E \longrightarrow F
The following properties are equivalent:
1) f is continuos in A
2) If T is a open set in (F,d'), then f^{-1}(T) is open set in the subspace (A,d)
3) If T is a closed set in (F,d'), then f^{-1}(T) is closed set in the subspace (A,d)
4) For all set S with S \subset A:
f(A \cap \overline{S} \subset \overline{f(S)}

I studied it in a course of "Introduction to Analysis" (It was roughly Metric Spaces Topology).
 
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Lee33 said:

Homework Statement



Prove that there does not exist a continuous, bijective function ##f:[0,1)\to \mathbb{R}.##

2. The attempt at a solution

I am stumped on how to do this question. What I was thinking of doing was assume that there is a function and arrive at a contradiction, in doing so I know I need to use the IVT since ##f## is assumed to be continuous, but I can't create such a contradiction.

Think back to one of your previous exercises and draw pictures of possibilities for the function. Using the IVT, isn't it true that since f is one-to-one then f([0,1/2])=[f(0),f(1/2)]? Now where are you going to put f((1/2,1))??
 
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Dick - So I can assume an ##x\in [0,1/2]## such that ##f(x)\le f(0)##?
 
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Lee33 said:
Dick - So I can assume an ##x\in [0,1/2)## such that ##f(x)<f(0)##?

Well, no. I actually stated what I said a little wrong. I meant that f([0,1/2]) is equal to either [f(0),f(1/2)] or [f(1/2),f(0)] depending on whether f(0)<f(1/2) or vice versa. You remember the previous exercise, right?
 
Hmm, can you elaborate a bit more? If I consider the case when ##f(0) <f(1/2)## then that must imply that ##[f(0),f(1/2]##?
 
But in that proof, we considered ##x\in (a,b)## such that ##f(x) <f(a)## and you said I can't do that here.
 
Lee33 said:
But in that proof, we considered ##x\in (a,b)## such that ##f(x) <f(a)## and you said I can't do that here.

In that proof they assumed a<b because they wanted to write the interval [a,b] without having to say [a,b] if a<b or [b,a] if b<a. It's not important. The substance of the proof is. In this case I know 0<1/2. So I don't have to say 'assume 0<1/2'. f([0,1/2]) is either [f(0),f(1/2)] or [f(1/2),f(0)] depending. That's what I would like you to confirm that you still understand. I don't know what this x is you are speaking of here.
 
  • #10
So, since this is a bijection then for ##0<1/2## we have ##[f(0), f(1/2)]## and for ##1/2 < 1## we have ##[f(1/2),f(1)]##.
 
  • #11
Lee33 said:
So, since this is a bijection then for ##0<1/2## we have ##[f(0), f(1/2)]## and for ##1/2 < 1## we have ##[f(1/2),f(1)]##.

No, you don't. I don't even think that means anything. f(1) isn't even necessarily defined. Can you just confirm that you understand why f([0,1/2]) is equal to either [f(0),f(1/2)] or [f(1/2),f(0)], you seemed comfortable with the proof yesterday.
 
  • #12
Yes, I can confirm that because we proved that yesterday.
 
  • #13
Lee33 said:
Yes, I can confirm that because we proved that yesterday.

Alright! Let's assume for the moment that f([0,1/2])=[f(0),f(1/2)]. Then f(3/4) is either greater than f(1/2) or less than f(0), right? You should really be drawing pictures here.
 
  • #14
I drew a graph of a function ##f(x) = x## so it's just a diagonal line. Now for ##f(3/4)## why would it be less that ##f(0)##?
 
  • #15
Lee33 said:
I drew a graph of a function ##f(x) = x## so it just a diagonal line. Now for ##f(3/4)## why would it be less that ##f(0)##?

f(x) is any bijective continuous function. It doesn't have to be f(x)=x. Draw a picture where you wiggle f(x) around anyway you want as long as it's continuous. I'm going to bed soon so I'll try and give you too many hints and see if you can figure it out. If f(3/4)>f(1/2), and since the function is onto, there must also be an x such that f(x)<f(0) and x must be greater than 1/2. Why? Try and draw such functions see why they can't be bijective. Using the IVT that would give you a contradiction with one-to-oneness. Just try it. I'll be back tomorrow.
 
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  • #16
Okay, I will try it. Thanks!
 
  • #17
Lee33 said:
Okay, I will try it. Thanks!

Actually trying to work your previous result into this isn't making it any simpler. Just think about f(0). Since f is onto, there must be an x in (0,1) such that f(x)=f(0)+1 and a y in (0,1) such that f(y)=f(0)-1. Just think about that.
 
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