Radial wave function in H atom

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the normalization and orthogonality properties of radial wave functions in the context of the hydrogen atom. Participants express challenges in understanding these concepts as presented in various textbooks and seek additional resources for clarification.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant requests detailed explanations about normalization and orthogonality of radial functions, noting that Laguerre associated polynomials do not resolve the issues directly due to differences in integration variables.
  • Another participant suggests that any quantum mechanics textbook should adequately cover these topics, referencing Griffiths and Schiff, but highlights that Schiff's book is no longer readily available.
  • Concerns are raised about the normalization constant and the orthogonalization of Laguerre polynomials, with a specific integral mentioned that should yield zero for different quantum numbers.
  • Suggestions for alternative textbooks include Pauling and Wilson, and Bethe and Salpeter, which are said to provide detailed explanations relevant to the questions posed.
  • One participant claims that the normalization provided on the Wikipedia page is correct and shares a Mathematica notebook for verification of this normalization for specific quantum states.
  • A participant mentions the need to calculate the normalization constant and understand the orthonormality of the functions, reiterating that Laguerre polynomial theory does not address these questions satisfactorily.
  • Another participant advises looking for a math textbook on special functions, noting that such resources were helpful in their own studies but cannot recall specific titles.
  • It is pointed out that generalized Laguerre polynomials are not orthonormal without the appropriate weighting function, which is included in the hydrogen wave function.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the adequacy of existing textbooks and resources for explaining normalization and orthogonality. There is no consensus on a single solution or resource that satisfactorily addresses all concerns raised.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in the existing literature, including missing details on normalization constants and the application of orthogonality conditions specific to the hydrogen atom's radial wave functions.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students and researchers in quantum mechanics, particularly those studying the hydrogen atom and related mathematical methods in physics.

facenian
Messages
433
Reaction score
25
helo can someone tell me where I can find detailed explanation about normalization and orthogonal properties of the radial functions since the books I've been reading do not explain enough, I thought Laguerre associated polynomials resolved the problem directly but this is not the case, the weighting function do not come up correctly and the integration variable are different in the two polynomials appearing in the integral,
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
strange; any textbook on quantum mechanics should explain this correctly
 
tom.stoer said:
strange; any textbook on quantum mechanics should explain this correctly

For intance, Griffiths sends you for details to L. Schiff, Quantum Mechanics(1968) a book no longer evailable in Amazon.
The problems are: 1) Normalization constant. Normalization of Laguerrre associated polynomials do not apply directly to this case and 2) Orthogonalization. We Know that \int R_{nl}(r)R_{ml}(r)r^2 dr=0,\,\,n\neq m however othogonalization of Laguerre polynomials do not apply directly either
 
Try Pauling and Wilson from 1935 by Dover and possibly reprinted since then. Also Bethe and Salpeter (1957), if available. They give all the details for your questions.
 
dextercioby said:
Try Pauling and Wilson from 1935 by Dover and possibly reprinted since then. Also Bethe and Salpeter (1957), if available. They give all the details for your questions.
ok, thanks. I bought Bethe's form Amazon at a good price.




phyzguy said:
I think the normalization given on the Wikipedia page below is correct. Also, attached is a Mathematica notebook which verifies this normalization for n=1,2,3.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_atom

My problem is that I want to actually calculate the normalization constant and also I want to know why they are orthonormal and as I said before Laguerre polynomial's theory do not answer this
 
Last edited:
Try looking for a math textbook that deals with the so-called "special functions": Bessel, Legendre, Laguerre, hypergeometric, etc. I used such a textbook in an "Intermediate Differential Equations" course in graduate school about thirty years ago. Unfortunately, I don't remember the book's title or author.
 
jtbell said:
Try looking for a math textbook that deals with the so-called "special functions": Bessel, Legendre, Laguerre, hypergeometric, etc. I used such a textbook in an "Intermediate Differential Equations" course in graduate school about thirty years ago. Unfortunately, I don't remember the book's title or author.

"Mathematical methods for physics and engineering" has a chapter dedicated to these functions. I would also recommend this book as the essential maths reference book to anyone taking a degree in a related area (maths, physics, engineering etc).

Edit: make sure you get the latest edition (if you're going to buy it) of course
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
674
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K