Raising and lowering operators for spin

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the conventions used for defining raising and lowering operators for spin, specifically the formulation \( S_{\pm} = S_x \pm i S_y \). Participants explore the mathematical and physical implications of these definitions, including their relation to angular momentum and the right-hand rule.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the convention of using \( S_x \) and \( S_y \) in the definition of raising and lowering operators, seeking clarification on the rationale behind this choice.
  • Another participant states that the raising operator \( S_+ \) raises the eigenvalue of \( S_z \) and that \( S_- \) lowers it, providing specific relationships between the operators and the eigenstates of \( S_z \).
  • A different participant asserts that the choice of \( S_x \) and \( S_y \) follows a right-hand convention, linking it to the mathematical definition of angular momentum.
  • Another viewpoint suggests that the formulation is a mathematical method, referencing how angular momentum operators behave under these definitions and cautioning against using a left-hand representation, which could lead to incorrect results.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the conventions used for the raising and lowering operators, with no consensus reached on the appropriateness of the right-hand versus left-hand representations.

Contextual Notes

Some participants mention the implications of using different conventions, such as the potential for confusion or errors when switching between right-hand and left-hand representations, but do not resolve these concerns.

lion8172
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When we set the raising and lowering operators for spin to be [tex]S_{\pm} = S_x \pm i S_y[/tex], what convention are we following (i.e. why is the first term taken to be S_x and the second taken to be S_y)?
 
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If we label the eigenstates of [itex]S_z[/itex] as [itex]|{+}\rangle[/itex] and [itex]|{-}\rangle[/itex], so that [itex]S_z|{\pm}\rangle=\pm\frac12 |{\pm}\rangle[/itex], then
[tex]S_+|{-}\rangle=|{+}\rangle[/tex]
[tex]S_-|{+}\rangle=|{-}\rangle[/tex]
Also,
[tex]S_+|{+}\rangle=0[/tex]
[tex]S_-|{-}\rangle=0[/tex]
That is, [itex]S_+[/itex] raises the value of [itex]S_z[/itex], and [itex]S_-[/itex] lowers it. That is how the raising and lowering operators are defined, and [itex]S_x \pm i S_y[/itex] is just what they work out to be.
 
lion8172 said:
When we set the raising and lowering operators for spin to be [tex]S_{\pm} = S_x \pm i S_y[/tex], what convention are we following (i.e. why is the first term taken to be S_x and the second taken to be S_y)?

It is the right hand convention.
think about the angular momentum...
it is defined mathematically L=R x P... it is a "right handed representation".
We can of sure define that in left hand repr...
 
I think that is a Math method.
Example:
angular momentum: After "operate" with Math signals, Lz will be raised or lowered. (with operation L+=Lx+iLy)

--
If define [tex]L \pm = L_x \pm iL_y[/tex]
When comute them:
[tex][L_z ,L \pm ] = ... = \pm \hbar (L_x \pm iL_y )[/tex]
(Griffiths D.J_Quantum Mechanics...)
If define "left hand" the signal will become to convert.
+- become -+
That is not good!
 
Last edited:

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