Rock climbing with forces along a "cam clamp" axle

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the forces acting on a cam clamp axle in the context of rock climbing. Participants are examining the relationships between gravitational force, normal force, and frictional force, particularly how these forces interact at angles related to the cam's geometry.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are questioning how the downward force is converted to an outward force along the cam and its relation to angles. There are requests for free body diagrams (FBD) to visualize the forces involved. Some express confusion about the relationship between normal force and gravitational force, particularly regarding their alignment and the angles involved.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants actively seeking clarification on the force relationships and geometry involved. There is a focus on drawing free body diagrams to aid understanding, and multiple interpretations of the forces are being explored without a clear consensus.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention educational practices regarding free body diagrams and torque balance, indicating a potential divergence in understanding or approach to the problem. There is also a suggestion that the model being used may not align with the physical setup being discussed.

aspodkfpo
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Homework Statement
Why is the downward force Ff all on the axle of the cam is converted (through the cam’s rigidity) to an outward force Fr on the rock, which acts along the line from the axle of the cam to the point of contact with the rock and how are you able to relate cos Ff and N to those angles on the cam?
Relevant Equations
Ffall = 2Fr sinφ
N = Fr cosφ
https://www.asi.edu.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/Physics_ASOE2015solutions.pdf
Q`12b)
Unable to understand how they deduct the relation between Ffall and N via the angles.
Unable to tell why this would act along the axle of the cam to the point of contact with the rod and be relatable to each other via the angle?

The model that I have in my head is that the gravitational force equals to the frictional force and there is a normal force, and that the gravitational force and the normal force do not relate to each other like this.
 
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aspodkfpo said:
Why is the downward force Ff all on the axle of the cam is converted (through the cam’s rigidity) to an outward force Fr on the rock, which acts along the line from the axle of the cam to the point of contact with the rock and how are you able to relate cos Ff and N to those angles on the cam?
Can you attempt to draw the FBD for one lobe of the cam and post it?
 
haruspex said:
Can you attempt to draw the FBD for one lobe of the cam and post it?
1597899179629.png

Specifically I don't see why Fn + Fg would equal a force that just happens to be at phi angle to the vertical. (this image should be rotated 90 degrees for the actual model)
 

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aspodkfpo said:
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Specifically I don't see why Fn + Fg would equal a force that just happens to be at phi angle to the vertical. (this image should be rotated 90 degrees for the actual model)
##F_g## should act at the pivot, and there should be another force at the pivot from the other lobe.
##F_f## should act at the rock surface.
Your ##F_N## arrow wanders around a bit. It should be normal to the rock surface, not passing through the angle on the other side of the cam.
 
haruspex said:
##F_g## should act at the pivot, and there should be another force at the pivot from the other lobe.
##F_f## should act at the rock surface.
Your ##F_N## arrow wanders around a bit. It should be normal to the rock surface, not passing through the angle on the other side of the cam.
Statement 1 and 2, we're taught to draw fbd from the centre of mass in schools now LOL.
Statement 3 and 4, can't draw something without the wobbles with a mouse, it's meant to be normal.
Still don't see why Fn + Fg would equal a force that just happens to be at phi angle to the vertical.
 
aspodkfpo said:
we're taught to draw fbd from the centre of mass in schools now
Then how do you figure out torque balance?
aspodkfpo said:
don't see why Fn + Fg would equal a force that just happens to be at phi angle to the vertical.
Because if not then torques would not balance and the cam would rotate.
 
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