Other Should I Become a Mathematician?

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Becoming a mathematician requires a deep passion for the subject and a commitment to problem-solving. Key areas of focus include algebra, topology, analysis, and geometry, with recommended readings from notable mathematicians to enhance understanding. Engaging with challenging problems and understanding proofs are essential for developing mathematical skills. A degree in pure mathematics is advised over a math/economics major for those pursuing applied mathematics, as the rigor of pure math prepares one for real-world applications. The journey involves continuous learning and adapting, with an emphasis on practical problem-solving skills.
  • #3,451
The size of this thread would only be a problem for me if there were too many daily posts to keep up on it. Currently that's not happening. It's less busier than the "Random Thoughts" thread, which is 1197 pages long and gets several posts a day, and even that one is not hard to navigate.

Thanks to all contributors to this thread.

-Dave K
 
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  • #3,452
I'm sorry to seem to jump on you Sankaku. I thought it was plausible that the smart alecky remarks were my own!

"absolutely! hear hear! what else could possibly be learned here? popularity is its own curse. If we let this thread go to a million views it may never die!"
 
  • #3,453
What grave misunderstandings abound!

Does studying math make you more smart alecky? I think my wife thinks so...
 
  • #3,454
Are the proofs we do in the olympiads(like IMO) upto the level required for maths study at university level? I have been studying stuff, in the training camps for the olympiad, that goes way beyond my school curriculum like classical inequalities(cauchy shwartz, chebychev), functional equations, number theory, proof based euclidian geometry and combinatorics. So how beneficial is this study with regards to a preparation for a career in mathematics? The level of problems in this olympiad math is quite high compared to the normal school curriculum.
Secondly, does undergraduate education play a big role in your future math education leading to research? Does one need to study in really good universities to get good undergrad education?
 
  • #3,455
shezi1995 said:
Are the proofs we do in the olympiads(like IMO) upto the level required for maths study at university level? I have been studying stuff, in the training camps for the olympiad, that goes way beyond my school curriculum like classical inequalities(cauchy shwartz, chebychev), functional equations, number theory, proof based euclidian geometry and combinatorics. So how beneficial is this study with regards to a preparation for a career in mathematics? The level of problems in this olympiad math is quite high compared to the normal school curriculum.
Secondly, does undergraduate education play a big role in your future math education leading to research? Does one need to study in really good universities to get good undergrad education?

These will all act as either tools in your proverbial toolbelt, examples to consider in further analysis, or a foundation for future insights.

Learning math is independent from where you go to school. Some schools will be more useful, but you can always learn on your own. As far as research goes, getting into research programs at more competitive schools is harder, and so in this case going to a less prestigious university may play into your favor.
 
  • #3,456
Is it possible to get into a good (top 20-30) PhD program in mathematics with a B.A. in math? I know a BS is usually the norm--however, if I have already done some research, expanded on my interests, etc. do you think it is possible to get into one of these programs?
 
  • #3,457
its all about how good people think you are. presumably some of your teachers have an opinion about this. letters on your degree are less important except to admissions committees who know no math.
 
  • #3,458
mathwonk said:
its all about how good people think you are. presumably some of your teachers have an opinion about this. letters on your degree are less important except to admissions committees who know no math.

Thank you. As a result, my courseload will be quite heavy. I will be taking Abstract Algebra, Real Analysis II, Complex Analysis, PDEs, and possibly an independent study in Riemann geometry next semester. Is that a doable courseload considering I go to a top 10ish school already?
 
  • #3,459
that's more than i could handle, but so what?
 
  • #3,460
Currently relearning H.S. Math from near scratch.

Current books:
- Serge Lang - Basic Mathematics (Certainly challenging but in a good way.)
- Algebra - Gelfand
- No B.S. Guide to Math and Physics - Ivan Savov (Enjoying this as it covers a lot of math and physics)
- Reading and thoroughly enjoying Ian Stewart's "Letter's to a young mathematician."

I am near clueless when it comes to geometry, I can't remember ever touching it initially in H.S. and haven't really encountered it in remedial courses nor in self study.

Does Serge Lang's Basic mathematics cover enough geometry to be successful in math intensive programs in University?


Debating whether I need a dedicated geometry book as well.
 
  • #3,461
I think you should follow your dreams, because if I didn't I would still be a McDonalds cook and not the C# engineer that I am today. Hope I helped :smile:
 
  • #3,462
I don't much like serge lang's basic math book. It seems like one of those books he dashed off on a weekend. i recommend a great book like euclid, with a guide such as my free epsilon camp notes our hartshorne's great companion book geometry: euclid and beyond.
 
  • #3,463
Hey guys, I'm a 10th grader in High school right now. I am "ahead" in math right now, meaning I'll being finishing the BS high school calculus classes next year. Yet I'm still with other "gifted" kids who know jack all about maths :P

My Senior year I plan on taking HL Math and tbh, I don't know much about it. I mean:
What do I learn? Is it harder calculus or a mix of a lot of stuff?
Is it even worth doing? I don't think colleges don't really look at it much despite it supposedly being hard.

It seems like i minus well take because, its math... As long as I'm learning. just wondering if there are better options, preferably that would also "impress" colleges.
Thanks for your time.
 
  • #3,464
Oh, and this is the IB program... Kind of regret doing it but we have no good ap classes where i live :(
 
  • #3,465
Eango said:
Oh, and this is the IB program... Kind of regret doing it but we have no good ap classes where i live :(

I don't know if I'm supposed to give input on this sticky because I'm no expert of math, just a student of math.

I enjoyed IB HL Math. It's good because it's less rote than AP BC Calculus, having topics like inductive proofs and options like group theory. Interesting and challenging. If you do a bit of self-study, IB Math HL will be good preparation for the AP Stats and AP BC exams.
 
  • #3,466
Eango said:
Hey guys, I'm a 10th grader in High school right now... As long as I'm learning. just wondering if there are better options, preferably that would also "impress" colleges.

So it sounds like you're in a school with no math geeks? A shame, but not a big problem as there is so much on line nowadays. The middle school and high school math geeks I know are enjoying math by:
  • doing math contests: lots of good choices (start with USAMTS if you're on your own)
  • doing classes using Art of Problem Solving (start with Intro to Number Theory or Intro to Counting and Probability). Play with Alcumus. Check out their forums to find like-minded students. Use their books (which are great) to teach yourself.
  • learning calculus for real (use Apostol or Spivak and do all the problems)
  • taking a MOOC in math in related topics (there's a Coursera/Stanford Cryptography class taught by Dan Boneh that's not bad). There are tons of these (e.g. search here).
  • going to a good class at a nearby college and sitting in on it (ask the prof)
  • going to math circles: find one near you by searching online (although this is more useful for younger kids)
  • going to math summer camps (Mathcamp is one of the best for your age, but you're too late for this summer -- check out their qualifying quiz for fun)
I coach math contest teams for middle school and high school kids whose schools don't serve them sufficiently, so I have quite a bit of experience with frustrated math geeks here in Silicon Valley. My 16yo (home schooled since 8th grade) is one of them. He doesn't like contests much, but it's just one thing among many.

Don't worry about doing things to impress colleges. The thing is, they're not very impressed by people who are doing things specifically to impress them. Going above and beyond to do stuff you love does impress them.

-IGU-
 
  • #3,467
I think I just gave advice for you one post above yours. i.e. read euclid. and euler. and my notes. good luck, but keep your eyes open.
 
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  • #3,468
Thanks guys!
I'm glad to hear IB HL math is better than ap calculus from someone in it. Thanks for your perspective. I now don't feel to bad being enrolled in it. I just hope my math teacher makes smart cuts (only 3 kids should be in it at my school).

I have been looking into competition math a lot lately too! I didn't do the math counts in middle school do not sure how it works :) (i was good at math at the time, but not near as smart and passionate). Thanks for the links there. I'm guessing it would be a team thing? If so, that would be awesome communicating with others who may be smarter than me :) art of problem solving looks like a great community! I will definitely check out their classes and soam their forums this summer and hopefully get a book asap. I've heard spivaks book starts out extremely hard whereas others will get progressively harder from the Internet. I guess I could handle it senior year if I do that art of problem solving exercises right?

Mathwonk, I'm definitely not ignoring you, I've read many of your helpful posts. This summer and doing next school year I'm going to really focus my efforts on Euclidean geometry since geometry is my weakest area.

Do my plan next year (junior) is ap calculus bc, competition math, and some self studying in Euclidean geometry and maybe some algebra if I find the time (which I will). Hopefully senior year I will be in good shape to start spivaks book during HL math (which will be a breeze then). I know jack about probability too so I guess HL math will teach me enough of the basics...

Also I'm not sure whether I want to become a mathematician or computer engineer/computer scientist. I've always wanted to be a computer guys but lately I'm starting to realize my talents and my likes are more in math :)
 
  • #3,469
sorry for any testy post. sometimes l unwisely post when I'm tired.
 
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  • #3,470
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  • #3,471
Hello all, I will be starting university in September in physics(mathematical physics honours, its just a double major) but I have started to realize that I spend a lot more time on math then I do on physics. I have finished a few basic calculus books; Quick Calculus - Kleppner/ramsey, Calculus made easy - Thompson, and a first course in calculus - lang. I also have apostol coming in the mail and have a copy of courant's book. also have a copy of pinter's abstract algebra book as well as lang's intro to linear algebra.

I feel a strong passion for mathematics building up each day. But i also feel my passion for physics slowly diminishing. i still enjoy reading physics textbooks and doing problems, but i would much rather be doing mathematics. The thing is, i know very little about the branch of mathematics and all its sub-fields. So just a few questions i have are:

1)What is mathematics research? (i.e. how do you conduct an "experiment", what do you do etc.) I realize this question is very broad and there are many different fields of mathematics but i am very curious to know.

2)What separates a good mathematician from a good physicist? this is more a question so i can find out more about myself and my interests. I want to know why i am getting more passionate about mathematics rather than physics. at the moment I find doing physics problems to be more of a drag whereas studying math i feel more excited and engaged.

3)since it's the title of the thread, Should i become a mathematician?(this ones just for fun, not serious)I do realize that I am just beginning university and don't need to pick a major yet, but I'm trying to do some self exploration and find out whether I really have a passion for math, or if it's just a summer fling :P

Thanks in advance!
 
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  • #3,472
Random question here.

When applying for grad school, in your personal statement, is it silly to include your math background? Should I assume the reader already knows my background (the transcripts)? I've TAed before, but I am not sure how to throw that into my PS.

Also I recently did some work for my prof. Basically he gave me a paper (I think he wrote it by hand) about an algorithm. He wrote some predictions and what not and asked me to write out the algorithm and comment on some runs. He later asked me to give him all the code, including the latex file. I am somewhat shy to ask him what he did with it.

In particular I feel like asking for authorship if he is going to include it in a paper, but I am embarrassed to ask since I didn't write anything, rather I just did some runs for him. The LaTeX file took a long time to prepare as well as the code.
 
  • #3,473
never be shy about asking for credit for your own work. no matter how little it is, the credit should be there.
 
  • #3,474
I've found this thread, and forum, most interesting.

I'm going to try not to write a wall of text, but I've had a lot of thoughts and ideas with no outlet for the last few months and it seems I've just found one. So apologies if it's long-winded. I'm probably going to ask about 3 semi-related questions so I'll try to section this thing off so it can be read...

1. My background in school/academia is as follows: Dropped out of high school in 9th grade, so middle school education. Found my way into university (don't ask how XD) and have junior status currently. I grew tired of the simplicity of my major (psychology) which is...a joke in difficulty, so I took calc 1 on a whim. I realized quickly that it was "plug and chug" I think they call it...but at least it was harder than social sciences. I am accustomed to solving most things faster/easier than most of my peers, as meaningless as SAT may be, I got a 1450 with 8th grade education, maybe that will give some indicator of natural ability for what it's worth. I give this as some kind of context to measure my first question.

I recently bought spivak's book on calculus since I actually want to learn it, not just do glorified algebra masquerading as calculus. It's certainly rigorous. However, as I'm accustomed to learning things much faster than most (academic things anyway...life is another matter), I'm a little curious about why...the proofs...make my head hurt XD. Should I expect to be able to do these? I'm talking chapter 1 mind you. I looked at a few of the problems...I've solved 3 after an embarassing interval it seems...maybe 4 hours of looking at them. Is this a sign I'm not suited for "real" math? It's not the difficulty, I enjoy that for a change, I know everything isn't easy. But I just kind of sit there and look at it...I try different avenues that don't really help. And some of them, I just can't see a way to even simplify at all. Should I just keep at it or what? Is it normal to struggle like this when it's your first time seeing it? What kind of strategy should I take? I'm confused b/c just sitting looking at these problems when I have no insight doesn't seem to be the best way to learn. I'll do it if that's what you have to do though, I really want to be able to understand this stuff.

Do bear in mind that my uni calc was a joke and really just consisted of plug n chug, we didn't learn *any* proofs or theory whatsoever. Felt easier than algebra really.

2. I'm trying to find tools and a vocabulary for the kind of research I'll eventually want to do. It's nebulous to say the least but...I'm looking at mathematics as a possible way to give me those tools. I want to be able to design simulations of populations of human beings exhibiting behaviors, maybe using computer models, to see what comes out. This would most certainly require designing models of some kind which involves math at least more complex than what I currently am able to do/grasp. I already think about things in this way, but I don't know *what* it is I'm wanting to do. I'm certain it has been thought of/tried before. I don't know what it's called. Game theory? Decision Theory? Nonlinear Dynamics? A branch/area of statistics? At this point in my understanding of maths I'm not really qualified to understand what I could do with those, let alone if I can find some novel applications in social sciences for them. Or if I can apply them in the way I'd like, or if it is even wise/logical to do so. Anyone have any insight into this?

3. Also, what would you suggest for someone with a spotty education to "shore up" their gaps in maths? I tried to go back and review high school curricula, but it's hard to see exactly what I'm missing. I couldn't tell from my calc and stat courses at my uni since they were a joke(we used set notations and whatnot in stat which were never explained...that my reason for taking calc, I wanted to see the nuts and bolts under the math which I knew they glossed over). I don't know if I can understand/complete spivak with my present knowledge base.
 
  • #3,475
doing spivak takes a lot of time. if you can do them at all, even in several hours, it is a good sign of your ability to me. it also teaches you a lesson in how hard math really should be if you are challenging yourself.
 
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  • #3,476
Hey mathwonk, would a grad admission officer laugh at me if I write I want to study differential geometry because of Spivak in my personal statement? And possibly mentioning going through his first year calculus book? Or would it be better to not write the latter at all? Depending on the pace, I am thinking about writing that I independently studied Spivak's Manifold book in my personal statement.

Thanks.
 
  • #3,477
that should be fine. just tell the truth. it helps you find your right place. good luck.
 
  • #3,478
I'll be studying computer science and engineering in three months time so I thought I'd use these three months for some preparation. I have calculus and discreet math in the first two semesters so I got Calculus Vol 1 by Apostol but it's proof heavy, do I need that much for college or should I get another book?
 
  • #3,479
gunslinger said:
I'll be studying computer science and engineering in three months time so I thought I'd use these three months for some preparation. I have calculus and discreet math in the first two semesters so I got Calculus Vol 1 by Apostol but it's proof heavy, do I need that much for college or should I get another book?

Not to put too fine a point on it, but Apostol is for those who want to understand calculus. For computer science and engineering there's no need to do that. For engineering calculus is a tool, so you have to know how it works, but not really why it works. For CS, calculus is hardly needed at all -- CS is mostly discrete math.

But if you want to learn calculus like a mathematician, then go for it. There's no way you'll get very far in Apostol in three months, but trying will certainly be good for you. You will likely find it quite difficult.

-IGU-
 
  • #3,480
i think it is beneficial to everyone to actually understand the tools they intend to use.
 

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