Should I first study the math or math and physics at the same time?

[TGV320]

Hi everyone,

After completing high school, I will enroll this fall at a 3 year technical school in China studying industrial robotics, but I still plan on getting into an undergrad physics program at a later time. (Some colleges can allow a transfer to their undergrad program after technical studies and studying directly from year 2 or 3).

Being hard working, patient and eager to learn, I am now preparing to study the equivalent of 3 years of physics undergad courses during my free time. I know it is going to be very challenging and difficult, but I am motivated and I can afford the necessary time. (Studying all day during the weekend and holidays is not a problem).

My level of math for the moment is everything before calculus (in China the math curriculum stopped right at the derivatives). As for physics, it was non calculus based. I really appreciate the underlying logic of the math, and knowing the workings of the physics.

I will mostly study with the online courses that I can find(MIT OCW) , always with the adequate textbooks and exercises that come with .

The first problem is that I don't know which subjects to study and in which order. By reading the guides of the forum, I learned that it would be better to have very good math skills before starting the physics part. Should I first study all the math before starting the physics, or study both at the same time? I really need some help from people with experience.

I have here two study orders:

A:

First year:

Calculus 1/2/3
Linear Algebra
Mathematical Analysis
Probability theory and statistics
Methods of mathematical physics

Second year:

Classical mechanics
Electromagnetism
Thermodynamics
Optics

Third year:

Quantum mechanics
Theoretical mechanics
Electrodynamics
Thermodynamics and statistical physics
Solid state physics

B:

First year:

Calculus 1 2 3
Mathematical Analysis
Linear Algebra
Classical mechanics
Thermodynamics

Second year:

Probability theory and statistics
Methods of mathematical physics
Electromagnetism
Optics
Theoretical mechanics

Third year:

Quantum mechanics
Electrodynamics
Thermodynamics and statistical physics
Solid state physics

Any kind of help would be greatly welcomed.

Thanks

 

[Frabjous]

You should worry about spreading yourself too thin. Start with calculus and classical mechanics and see how it goes.

 

[jtbell]

In the US, physics students normally start with a two-semester "calculus-based" introductory course using a textbook such as Halliday, Resnick and Walker's Fundamentals of Physics. There are other similar textbooks (competitors!). These books actually do not require much calculus: an intuitive understanding of the concepts of derivatives and integrals of a single variable, and the ability to compute them for simple functions like polynomials, sines, cosines and exponentials.

In fact, at many universities, the introductory physics course (using such books) is taught in such a way that calculus 1 and 2 can be taken concurrently with it. Students don't need the sophisticated techniques for computing complex derivatives and integrals, that calculus courses spend a lot of time on. They don't need to complete a full two or three semesters of calculus before starting physics.

Intermediate-level physics textbooks on specific subjects (e.g. Griffiths's Introduction to Electrodynamics) do require a deeper knowledge of calculus and differential equations. They also assume that the student has already completed an introductory physics course.

Universities in other countries may do things differently. I can't speak to that.

 

[CrysPhys]

OP: If you plan to follow the MIT OCW program, then look up the current MIT physics and math curriculum. For each course, it will tell you the prerequisite or corequisite courses (if any). Most of the course numbers haven't changed in decades; so most likely you can match the current course number with the OCW course number. In case the course number has changed, it will be readily apparent from the course descriptions.

For example, from http://catalog.mit.edu/subjects/8/, we have the following listing:

8.02 Physics II​

Prereq: Calculus I (GIR) and Physics I (GIR)
U (Fall, Spring)
3-2-7 units. PHYSICS II
Credit cannot also be received for 8.021, 8.022, ES.802, ES.8022
Introduction to electromagnetism and electrostatics: electric charge, Coulomb's law, electric structure of matter; conductors and dielectrics. Concepts of electrostatic field and potential, electrostatic energy. Electric currents, magnetic fields and Ampere's law. Magnetic materials. Time-varying fields and Faraday's law of induction. Basic electric circuits. Electromagnetic waves and Maxwell's equations. Subject taught using the TEAL (Technology Enabled Active Learning) studio format which utilizes small group interaction and current technology to help students develop intuition about, and conceptual models of, physical phenomena.
J. Belcher, I. Cisse

 

[TGV320]

Hi,
Thanks a lot for the advice. I will not rush too much on the subjects and instead learn the material well before learning the next one. The math seems to be really the starting point to all other subjects.

 

[jtbell]

In fact, at many universities, the introductory physics course (using such books) is taught in such a way that calculus 1 and 2 can be taken concurrently with it.

For example, from http://catalog.mit.edu/subjects/8/, we have the following listing:

8.02 Physics II​

Prereq: Calculus I (GIR) and Physics I (GIR)

...and 8.01 Physics I does not have Calculus I as pre-requisite.

However, I expect that students entering MIT have already studied some calculus in high school, anyway.

 

[Vanadium 50]

8.01 does have calculus as a co-req, either formally or informally. A freshman would take 18.01 and 8.01 concurrently.

 

[FactChecker]

I recommend you pick a university and look at its course sequence and the associated textbooks. Follow those, paying particular attention to the prerequisites and co-requisites.

 

[TGV320]

Helllo,
Very well, I shall look around . Thanks.

 

[TGV320]

Hello,

Well, it's been over a year now and lots of things happenned. Studying math along with my own faculty courses, going through the end of the epidemic, etc.

One's might find it ridiculous, but I'm finally near the end of Calc 3, just struggled with Green's theorem today.

I had to switch back to using chinese video lectures with chinese textbooks, who are in fact translated cold war era Soviet textbooks, quite the bumby ride. I guess I just couldn't adapt to the way american students use to study. Luckily the teacher in the video lectures is quite good.

Thanks again for those who helped me get on track.

Cheers