Simple Modules and quotients of maximal modules, Bland Ex 13

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a statement from Paul E. Bland's book regarding maximal submodules and their implications for factor modules. Participants are trying to understand and prove the assertion that if ##N## is a maximal submodule of ##M##, then ##M/N## is a simple ##R##-module. The scope includes theoretical exploration and mathematical reasoning related to module theory.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Peter expresses confusion about Bland's Example 13 and requests a formal proof regarding the simplicity of the module ##M/N## when ##N## is a maximal submodule of ##M##.
  • Participants question the nature of submodules of ##M/N## and the identification of the zero element in this factor module.
  • Peter describes the elements of ##M/N## as cosets of the form ##\{ x + N \}_{ x \in M }## and identifies the zero element as ##N = \{ 0 + N \}##.
  • Another participant confirms that any submodule of ##M/N## must contain the zero element and discusses the implications of maximality, leading to the conclusion that ##M/N## has no proper submodules, aligning with the definition of a simple module.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants are engaged in a collaborative exploration of the concepts, but there is no consensus on the proof or understanding of the statement from Bland's example. Uncertainty remains regarding the identification of submodules of ##M/N##.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in understanding the definitions and properties of submodules and factor modules, as well as the implications of maximality in this context.

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I am reading Paul E. Bland's book, "Rings and Their Modules".

I am focused on Chapter 1, Section 1.4 Modules ... ...

I need help with the proving a statement Bland makes in Example 13 ... ...

Example 13 reads as follows:
?temp_hash=163dad38af054a70ffbbb915d74f3af9.png

In the above text from Bland, we read the following:

" ... If ##N## is a maximal submodule of ##M##, then it follows that ##M/N## is a simple ##R##-module ... ... "I do not understand why this is true ... can anyone help with a formal proof of this statement ...
Hope someone can help ...

Peter
 

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What are the submodules of ##M/N\,##? And what is the zero element in this factor module?
 
fresh_42 said:
What are the submodules of ##M/N\,##? And what is the zero element in this factor module?
Hi fresh_42 ...

I cannot answer you with confidence ... which is probably why I do not follow Bland Example 13 ... but ...

The elements of ##M/N## are the cosets ##\{ x + N \}_{ x \in M }## where ##x + N = \{ x + n \ | \ n \in N \}## ... ...

... BUT? ... what are the submodules of ##M/N## ... I am unsure ...

Zero element would be ##N = \{ 0 + N \}## ...

Can you help further ... ?

Peter
 
Math Amateur said:
Hi fresh_42 ...

I cannot answer you with confidence ... which is probably why I do not follow Bland Example 13 ... but ...

The elements of ##M/N## are the cosets ##\{ x + N \}_{ x \in M }## where ##x + N = \{ x + n \ | \ n \in N \}## ... ...

... BUT? ... what are the submodules of ##M/N## ... I am unsure ...

Zero element would be ##N = \{ 0 + N \}## ...

Can you help further ... ?

Peter
Yes, exactly. But zero is in any submodule. So a submodule of ##M/N## as a set ##S := \{x + N \,\vert \, x \in \textrm{ something }\}## has to contain ##N##. Now ##N \subseteq S \subseteq M## is maximal, so ##S## is either equal to ##M## or equal to ##N##. But this means ##S/N = M/N## or ##S/N=N/N=\{0\}## which is the definition of a simple module: ##M/N## has no proper submodules ##S/N##.
 
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