Slope of an Energy with Friction Graph?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the effects of friction on the slope and y-intercept of a graph representing the relationship between kinetic energy (KE), potential energy (PE), and work (W). The original poster is exploring how the inclusion of friction alters these graph characteristics in a physics context.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to understand the implications of friction on the slope and y-intercept of the energy graph, questioning whether the slope would be less than 1 and the y-intercept below 0. Some participants discuss the definitions of work and how they relate to the changes observed in the graph.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively exploring different interpretations of how friction affects the graph. Some guidance has been offered regarding the definitions of work and the roles of different forces, but there is no explicit consensus on the final outcome of the discussion.

Contextual Notes

There is a consideration of how work is defined in relation to friction and the original force, which may influence the interpretation of the graph's characteristics. The original poster's experimental results are also mentioned as a factor in their reasoning.

Londoncalling
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Homework Statement


An object is pulled at a constant F. KE0+PE0=0, so W=PE+KE. If there were no friction, the slope of a graph (KE+PE=Y-axis, W=X-axis) would be 1 and the y-intercept would be 0. What would the addition of friction do to the slope and y intercept (would the y intercept be more, less, or equal to 0 and the slope more, less, or equal to 1)

Homework Equations



KE0+PE0+W=PE+KE

The Attempt at a Solution


At first I thought that the slope would be less than 1 and the y intercept below 0, since my experimental results seemed to confirm this and since friction would be "taking" energy away. However, one of my classmates told me there should be no change. Can anyone explain this problem to me?
 
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It depends on how you define your work. If your work includes the work done by friction, then there would be essentially no change. If your work only includes work done by the original force, there should be a change.
 
Just so I can understand this--is this because friction would be taking away from both sides of the equation? Why "essentially" no change?
 
You have work done by both forces. Usually, we define the work done by your force to be positive. In that case, the work done by friction is negative (and is equal to the loss in KE and PE).

So, if you include friction, the graph wouldn't change. The PE+KE of the particle would go down because friction is converting that energy into heat, BUT, the negative work of friction would also bring your W down by the exact same amount. If you don't include friction, the graph will change. The work done by your force is the same, but the PE+KE of the particle will go down due to friction.
 

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