Smoke Signals vs Sound Signals - Propagation Distance

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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the comparative propagation distances of smoke signals and sound signals, examining factors such as environmental conditions, medium properties, and historical contexts of use. The conversation includes theoretical considerations and anecdotal examples.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that smoke signals can propagate further than sound signals due to visibility over longer distances, as light travels differently than sound.
  • It is noted that sound waves can be absorbed by objects, leading to faster attenuation compared to light in air.
  • One participant points out that the medium affects propagation, stating that sound attenuates faster in air than in water, while light travels better in a vacuum.
  • A comparison is made regarding the capabilities of whales, which can communicate over long distances underwater, highlighting that different species experience sound and light propagation differently.
  • Another participant mentions that environmental factors, such as weather conditions and landscape, significantly influence the effectiveness of smoke and sound signals.
  • Historical context is introduced, with references to how smoke and sound signals were used in various terrains, suggesting that their effectiveness is context-dependent.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the effectiveness of smoke versus sound signals, with no consensus reached on a definitive answer. The discussion remains unresolved with various factors and contexts considered.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on specific environmental conditions, the properties of different media, and the historical context of signal use, which are not fully explored or resolved in the discussion.

Wardlaw
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Why is it that smoke signals can propagate information over longer distances than sound signals?
 
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As smoke rises, people will be able to see it from far due to light. However, for sound signals, the sound wave will be absorbed by objects and thus, the wave will dissipate over a distance.
 
As elitewarr said, it's a matter of light versus sound.

It just happens that sound attenuates faster in air than light. Replace the air with water, and you have the opposite.

(You could also replace the air with steel for a clear victory for sound, or replace the air with a vacuum for a clear victory for light).
 
Wardlaw said:
Why is it that smoke signals can propagate information over longer distances than sound signals?

Since you are talking over the internet, I assume you are asking humans this question. Generally we can see further than we can hear in our normal environment.

But, ask a whale a similar question and he will laugh at you. He can hear and communicate across half the world by submerging to the depth of the SOFAR channel, which acts as an acoustic waveguide. Yet, he can not see past the horizon on a clear day, at the surface.

By the way, whales have had their own global internet for many millennia.
 
elect_eng said:
Since you are talking over the internet, I assume you are asking humans this question. Generally we can see further than we can hear in our normal environment.

But, ask a whale a similar question and he will laugh at you. He can hear and communicate across half the world by submerging to the depth of the SOFAR channel, which acts as an acoustic waveguide. Yet, he can not see past the horizon on a clear day, at the surface.

By the way, whales have had their own global internet for many millennia.

Aren't you a clever cookie
 
Cause a 1 km peak can be easily seen from 10 km, while a bang that can be heard at 10 km will blow you era drums. (Heavily depending on weather conditions)
 
Smoke rises, and on a calm day very high. This can be seen from afar.
If done properly and under the right atmospheric conditions, a sort of "Morse code" or native language smoke code, can be very effective for long distances.

Drum beats or horn sounds are used as well, but for much shorter distances, and usually in the case of direct battle.
 
First of all you have to look at where in the past sound and smoke signals were used and why. In a jungle with a canopy of trees, the smoke signals would be dispersed, mixed, and combined. In say the mountains, smoke would usually be blown, so horns were used. In flat plains where there was no tree canopy, and often still air conditions, smoke would be used.

So it more depends on the landscape where they were used.
 
haha someones looking for answers for universe and everything(uni class)... :p
 
  • #10
elect_eng said:
the SOFAR channel

LOL @ So Far channel. I just had to look that up, hilarious name.
 

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