Solution to a differential equation with variable coefficients

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges of solving high order homogeneous differential equations with variable coefficients without any given solutions. Participants explore various methods and approaches, including numerical techniques and specific algorithms, while questioning the feasibility of deriving solutions from scratch.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses difficulty in finding methods for solving high order homogeneous differential equations with variable coefficients without a known solution.
  • Another participant suggests that numerical methods may be the only viable approach for complex cases, noting the popularity of tools like MATLAB in engineering.
  • A participant mentions Eureqa as a tool for discovering functions from data, although it may not align with the original question.
  • Several participants discuss the Kovacic algorithm, which can find solutions if they are Liouvillian, and mention its basis in differential Galois theory and Picard-Vessiot theory.
  • There is a suggestion that the Kovacic algorithm can be extended to higher order ODEs, but the complexity of the methods involved is acknowledged.
  • One participant highlights that finding rational solutions to a Riccati ODE can lead to Liouvillian solutions for second order linear ODEs, but notes the systematic approach is often too complex for manual calculations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that there are no straightforward algorithms for finding general solutions to these equations without prior solutions. However, there are competing views on the effectiveness of numerical methods versus symbolic algorithms like the Kovacic method.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in existing methods, particularly the reliance on known solutions or specific conditions for algorithms like Kovacic. The complexity of the algorithms and the potential for lengthy calculations are also noted.

mertcan
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Hi, I really struggled to dig valuable things out of internet and books related to high order homogeneous differential equation with variable coefficients but I have nothing. All methods I see involves given solution and try to find others(like reduction of order method), even for second order homogeneous differential equation with variable coefficients case methods involves a known solution. My question is: WITHOUT ANY GIVEN SOLUTION how can we derive the solutions or just a solution of high order homogeneous differential equation with variable coefficients?
 
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My guess would be numerically for the hardest of these as textbooks tend to focus on ones with exact solutions or ones that fall to known methods of solution. It is perhaps why MATLAB and related tools are so popular today in engineering fields.
 
jedishrfu said:
My guess would be numerically for the hardest of these as textbooks tend to focus on ones with exact solutions or ones that fall to known methods of solution. It is perhaps why MATLAB and related tools are so popular today in engineering fields.
Thanks for return but as far as I know numerical methods are aimed at finding some value at some t using finite difference schemes..., not finding a function with respect to t. My question is: WITHOUT ANY GIVEN solution (as a function of t) how we can find the solution(s) of variable coefficient high order homogenous differential equation(as a function of t)?
 
There are no algorithms for finding even the general solution of a second order homogeneous ODE with variable coefficients. There is however an algorithm to find the solution if the solution is Liouvillian, which is based on differential Galois theory and Picard-Vessiot theory, this is the Kovacic algorithm. This is the algorithm that e.g. wolfram, mathematica, maple etc. uses to symbolically solve homogeneous ODEs. Kovacic method has been extended to higher order ODEs as well.
 
bigfooted said:
There are no algorithms for finding even the general solution of a second order homogeneous ODE with variable coefficients. There is however an algorithm to find the solution if the solution is Liouvillian, which is based on differential Galois theory and Picard-Vessiot theory, this is the Kovacic algorithm. This is the algorithm that e.g. wolfram, mathematica, maple etc. uses to symbolically solve homogeneous ODEs. Kovacic method has been extended to higher order ODEs as well.
Thanks for return@bigfooted by the way do you have any idea about WITHOUT ANY GIVEN SOLUTION how can we derive the solutions or just a solution of high order homogeneous differential equation with variable coefficients?
 
Well, that is what the Kovacic algorithm does for instance. For second order linear ODE's, you can prove that all Liouvillian solutions can be found by finding rational solutions to a Riccati ODE. And finding these solutions can be done in a systematic way by solving systems of polynomial equations. But these algorithms are usually too lengthy to do by hand, that is why we only learn about some simple limit cases in any course on differential equations (like constant coefficient ODEs).
 

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