Solving for $k$: When Does $P(P(x))$ Have 3 Real Roots?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the polynomial function $P(x)=x^2+6x+k$ and seeks to determine the values of $k$ for which the composition $P(P(x))$ results in exactly three distinct real roots. The scope includes mathematical reasoning and exploration of polynomial behavior.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant defines the polynomial $P(x)$ and poses the question regarding the conditions on $k$ for $P(P(x))$ to have three distinct real roots.
  • Another participant presents a derived function $G(y)=P(P(y))= y^4+(2k-12)y^2+h(k)$, where $h(k) = k^2-11k+27$, and notes a correction regarding a typo.
  • It is noted that $G(y)$ is symmetrical about $y=0$ and that $G'(0)=0$, suggesting specific properties of the roots.
  • A participant claims that the roots of $h(k)$ determine the number of roots in $G(y)$, indicating that only the smaller root of $h(k)$ leads to three roots in $G(y)$, while the larger root results in a double root.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants present differing views on the implications of the roots of $h(k)$, with some agreeing on the relationship between the roots and the number of distinct real roots in $P(P(x))$, while others may have alternative interpretations or calculations that remain unaddressed.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes a correction regarding a typo in the expression for $h(k)$, and there may be unresolved assumptions regarding the nature of the roots and their implications for the polynomial's behavior.

anemone
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Let $P(x)=x^2+6x+k$ for all real $x$, where $k$ is some real number. For what values of $k$ does $P(P(x))$ have exactly 3 distinct real roots?
 
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WLOG: Let x=y-3

G(y)=P(P(y))= y^4+(2k-12)y^2+h(k)
where h(k) = k^2-11k+21

Note 1: G(y) symmetrical about y=0
Note 2: G'(0)=0

Therefore: Answer is root(s) of h(k)
 
Last edited:
My solution:

We find:

$$P(P(x))=\left(x^2+6x+k\right)^2+6\left(x^2+6x+k\right)+k=x^4+12x^3+2kx^2+42x^2+12kx+36x+k^2+7k$$

And so we find the discriminant is:

$$256k^4-7424k^3+78336k^2-352512k+559872=256(k-9)^2\left(k^2-11 k+27\right)$$

In order for there to be 3 distinct real roots, we must have 4 real roots, two of which are repeated, and so the discriminat must be zero.

Thus, we have the candidates:

$$k\in\left\{9,\frac{11\pm\sqrt{13}}{2}\right\}$$

When $k=9$, we find a repeated set of complex conjugate roots. When $$k=\frac{11+\sqrt{13}}{2}$$, we find that we have a repeated real root and a pair of complex conjugate roots.

But, when $$k=\frac{11-\sqrt{13}}{2}$$, we find we have the 3 distinct real roots:

$$x\in\left\{-3,-3\pm\sqrt{1+\sqrt{13}}\right\}$$
 
RLBrown said:
WLOG: Let x=y-3

G(y)=P(P(y))= y^4+(2k-12)y^2+h(k)
where h(k) = k^2-11k+21

Note 1: G(y) symmetrical about y=0
Note 2: G'(0)=0

Therefore: Answer is root(s) of h(k)

G(y)=P(P(y))= y^4+(2k-12)y^2+h(k)
where h(k) = k^2-11k+27 <--- Typo correction

Note 1: G(y) symmetrical about y=0
Note 2: G'(0)=0

Therefore: Answer is root(s) of h(k)

As MarkFL points out, only the smaller root of h(k) produces 3 roots in G(y) and P(P(x)).
The larger root of h(k) produces only one double root in G(y) and P(P(x)).
 
Last edited:

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