Solving system of equations to find angle and energy of Au atom and α

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a problem involving the collision of an alpha particle with a gold atom, focusing on the conservation of energy and momentum to determine the angle and momentum of the gold atom and alpha particle after the collision.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the conservation equations for energy and momentum, questioning the algebraic manipulations involved in solving for the unknowns.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided guidance on reviewing algebraic steps and potential typographical errors in the equations. Others have shared their own attempts to solve the problem using computational tools, indicating a collaborative effort to identify mistakes and clarify reasoning.

Contextual Notes

There is mention of adopting units where the speed of light is set to one, which may affect the interpretation of the equations. Participants are also considering the implications of combining numerical values early in the calculations.

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Homework Statement



An alpha particle traveling with a kinetic energy of 5.5 MeV and a rest-mass of 3727.8 MeV/c^2 strikes a gold atom with a rest-mass of 183,476 MeV/c^2.

-The gold atom is initially at rest
-The alpha particle deflects perpendicular to the horizontal in the after state

4gkewl.jpg


Homework Equations



Conservation of Energy:

Ebefore=Eafter


Conservation of momentum:

Pbefore=Pafter


E^2=P^2c^2+(mc^2)^2


The Attempt at a Solution



Total Energy Before Collison:

Ebefore=E(α)+E(Au)=3727.8MeV+5.5MeV+183476MeV=187,209MeV


Momentum before (in x-direction):

E^2=p^2c^2+(mc^2)^2

==> (3727.8+5.5)^2=P^2c^2+(3727.8)^2

==> P=202.6 MeV/c


AFTER STATE:

Conservation of momentum:

in x: P(Au)cosθ=202.6MeV/c (1)

in y: P(Au)sinθ-P(α)=0 (2)


Conservation of Energy:

E(Au)=√(P(Au)^2+183476^2)
E(α)=√(P(α)^2+3727.8^2)

==> √(P(Au)^2+183476^2)+√(P(α)^2+3727.8^2)=187,209 MeV (3)



Solve the system of equations to find θ, P(Au), and P(α):

Solve (3) for P(α):

P(α)=√(1.36998E9-P(Au)^2)


Plug back into Eq. (2):

P(Au)sinθ=√(1.36998E9-P(Au)^2)


Solve (1) for θ:

θ=arccos(202.6/P(Au))


Plug into (2) and solve for Au:

P(Au)sin[arccos(202.6/P(Au))]=√(1.36998E9-P(Au)^2)

==> P(Au)=26,172.7 MeV/c


Solve for θ:

26,172.7cosθ=202.6

==> θ=89.56°


Solve for P(α):

26,172.7sin(89.56°)=P(α)

==> P(α)=26,171.9 MeV/c



However, when I plug these numbers back into equation (3) the solution doesn't come out right. I have been looking over this for hours and can't figure out where my error might be.

Thanks!
 
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Possibly algebra problems?
Go through each step carefully - without going too deep, the following stood out:
E(Au)=√(P(Au)^2+183476^2)
E(α)=√(P(α)^2+3727.8^2)
Are you missing a c^2 in there? Typo?
Solve (3) for P(α):
P(α)=√(1.36998E9-P(Au)^2)
#3 was:
√(P(Au)^2+183476^2)+√(P(α)^2+3727.8^2)=187,20 9 MeV (3)
... is there a c^2 missing there too?
How did you get from this to your conclusion
P(Au)sin[arccos(202.6/P(Au))]=√(1.36998E9-P(Au)^2)

==> P(Au)=26,172.7 MeV/c
Have I read that right:
##p_{Au}\sin(\arccos(202.6/p_{Au}))=\sqrt{1.36998\times 10^9 - p_{Au}} \\ \Rightarrow p_{Au}=26172.7\text{MeV/c}##
... how did you manage to ull out the ##p_{Au}## ?

... I'm not saying these are the mistakes - only that this is what stands out.
 
I looked back over each step carefully. I must have made my mistake when solving for Pα in Equation 3. I ended up writing a script on MATLAB that solved for the three unknowns and got the answers that way. Thanks for the tips!
 
That's where I think it first went pear shaped too ... the c^2 thing you can get away with by adopting units so that c=1. Many people do that implicitly.

A good discipline is to do all the algebra in the symbols, leaving the numbers to last.
Worst case is, you'll have a clear path to backtrack and troubleshoot - in this case, a lot was hidden when you combined numbers so I couldn't tell what you'd done.

Still... no worries aye ;)
 

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