The average value of S operator

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the average value of the spin operator S in the context of spin-orbit coupling in quantum mechanics, specifically relating to the fine structure of hydrogen. Participants explore the implications of the average value of the S operator and its projection onto the total angular momentum J.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the assumption made in a textbook regarding the average value of the S operator being the projection onto J.
  • Another participant proposes calculating the commutator of the fine-structure Hamiltonian with the S operator, asking for the result in vector form.
  • A further contribution indicates that the algebra leads to a specific form of the commutator, suggesting a relationship between the components of S and J, and applying the Ehrenfest theorem to derive a time evolution equation for the average value of S.
  • The same participant notes that S can be decomposed into components parallel and perpendicular to J, with only the perpendicular component exhibiting time dependence, likening its behavior to that of a spinning top.
  • It is mentioned that the time-averaged value of the perpendicular component of S is zero.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing levels of understanding regarding the assumptions in the textbook and the implications of the mathematical derivations. The discussion includes both exploratory reasoning and technical calculations without reaching a consensus on the initial assumption about the average value of S.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions regarding the definitions of the operators and their components may not be explicitly stated, and the relationship between the components of S and J is dependent on the algebraic manipulations performed.

Viona
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Why the average value of S operator is considered to be the projection of S onto J ?
While reading in the book of Introduction to Quantum Mechanics by David Griffith in the section of Fine structure of Hydrogen: spin- orbit coupling, he said that the average value of S operator is considered to be the projection of S onto J. I could not understand why he assumed that. please help me to understand.
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Given the fine-structure Hamiltonian ##H = A\vec{L} \cdot \vec{S}##, try to calculate the commutator ##[H,\vec{S}]##. What do you get, in vector form?
 
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What I was getting at is that if you do the algebra, I get $$[H,\vec{S}] = iA\vec{S} \times \vec{L} = iA\vec{S} \times \vec{J}$$ where the last step is true because ##\vec{J} = \vec{L} + \vec{S}##. Use the Ehrenfest theorem on this to get $$\frac{d\langle \vec{S} \rangle}{dt} = \frac{A}{\hbar} \langle \vec{S} \times \vec{J} \rangle $$

##\vec{S}## can be split into two components: ##S_{||}## which is parallel to ##\vec{J}## and ##\vec{S}_{\perp}## which is perpendicular to ##\vec{J}##. Since the cross product cancels the parallel part, only the perpendicular part has time dependence (it precesses). The equation for ##\langle \vec{S}_{\perp} \rangle## is the equation for a spinning top (precession). The time averaged value of ##\vec{S}_{\perp}## is zero.
 
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Thank you all for useful replies.
 

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