The Wildest point on an ellipse

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around identifying the "wildest" points on an ellipse, specifically focusing on the curvature of the ellipse and how to mathematically determine where this curvature is maximized. The conversation includes elements of vector calculus and parametric equations, with participants exploring the implications of curvature in the context of an ellipse defined in the xy-plane.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Debate/contested, Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant introduces a formula for curvature, K(t), and seeks to determine the maximum curvature points on an ellipse.
  • Another participant suggests that instead of simplifying the expression, differentiation could be used to find the maximum curvature.
  • Some participants propose that the points with the largest curvature are located at the ends of the major axis, while the points with the smallest curvature are at the ends of the minor axis.
  • A later reply acknowledges the hypothesis about curvature but expresses a desire to verify it independently.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

There is some agreement on the hypothesis regarding the locations of maximum and minimum curvature on the ellipse, but the method for determining these points remains a topic of discussion, with differing opinions on whether simplification or differentiation is the appropriate approach.

Contextual Notes

The discussion does not resolve the mathematical steps involved in calculating the curvature or the implications of the proposed methods, leaving some assumptions and dependencies on definitions unaddressed.

Diffy
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The motivation behind my question stems from my own curiosity. There was recently a post in this forum titled "The Widest Point on an ellipse" (or something to that effect). In any event, I misread the title, as "The wildest". I got to thinking, and remembered from vector calculus there existed a formula to measure the severity of a curve at any point.

The formula is as follows:
K(t) = \frac{||r\prime(t) \times r\prime\prime(t)||}{||r\prime(t)||^3}

Where r(t) is our curve in parametric form.

I wanted to use this to figure out in general , what points on an ellipse are the wildest, ie at which points can we find a maximum value for K?

To keep things simple I assumed the ellipse I would look at would be soley in the xy plane. the equation I decided on is the following:

r(t) =\left( \begin{array}a a\cos(t) \\ b \sin(t) \\0 \end{array}<br /> \right)

Now I am running into a problem when trying to calulate K(t)

The numerator actually works out very nice:
\pm 2ab

the denominator I can't figure out. I get stuck at this:
(\sqrt{a^2\sin(t)^2 + b^2 \cos(t)^2})^3

Anyone see a way to reduce this?
 
Last edited:
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Why do you need to simplify it? Just differentiate and solve for the maximum.
 
The "wildest" points on an ellipse, the points with largest curvature are the points at the ends of the major axis. The points with the smallest curvature are the points at the ends of the minor axis.
 
HallsofIvy said:
The "wildest" points on an ellipse, the points with largest curvature are the points at the ends of the major axis. The points with the smallest curvature are the points at the ends of the minor axis.


I was going to mention that this was my hypothesis, but I wanted to figure it out for myself.
 
Vid said:
Why do you need to simplify it? Just differentiate and solve for the maximum.

Ah ha! Of course...

Thanks, man.
 

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