Transformations of energy in oscillatory motion

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the transformations of energy in oscillatory motion, specifically focusing on a mass attached to a spring and the effects of gravitational potential energy in vertical motion. The original poster questions the role of gravitational potential energy in the equations governing the system, particularly in relation to the energy stored in the spring.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to reconcile the potential energy of gravity with the energy equations for oscillatory motion, expressing confusion about whether the spring's potential energy already accounts for gravitational effects. Other participants suggest using free-body diagrams and considering the equilibrium position to clarify the relationship between gravitational force and spring force.

Discussion Status

Participants are exploring the implications of including gravitational potential energy in the analysis of the system. Some guidance has been offered regarding the use of free-body diagrams and the derivation of equations that incorporate gravity, but there is no explicit consensus on the completeness of the equations or the treatment of potential energy in this context.

Contextual Notes

The discussion is framed within the constraints of standard physics assumptions, such as neglecting friction and treating the spring as ideal. The original poster's references to external resources indicate a search for clarity on how gravitational potential energy is integrated into the analysis of vertical oscillatory motion.

mcaay
Messages
7
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement


I thought that in the situation where mass is attached to the string and put into motion (vertically), energy goes between 1/2 kA^2 and 1/2 mV^2 like here - http://imgur.com/RU4P6UW

However in student's book I saw the table, which said that potential energy of gravity is also changing, which is logical, but I didn't see it included in equations anywhere for above situation.

For example here it isn't included: http://www.acs.psu.edu/drussell/Demos/SHO/mass.html

Homework Equations


Does it mean that 1/2 kA^2 already covers potential energy of gravity? I can't see any other explanation that would work, but I don't understand why would that be, because 1/2 kA^2 is supposed to be potential energy of oscillatory motion, and in horizontal situation equations are the same without any change in potential energy of gravity.

Maybe the equations are incomplete? If that's the case, then how should they look like?

The Attempt at a Solution


(1st link)
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The standard derivation for mass-on-a-spring SHM assumes no gravity, or friction, or any other forces besides the spring.
The spring is also modeled as an ideal massless spring that always obeys Hook's law.
IRL you need to account for these things.

You can use a free-body diagram to help you see what the equation's look like if you include gravity...
You may want to make the near-Earth approximation for gravitational potential energy and force and take care to pick a suitable position for zero potential energy.
http://www.ux1.eiu.edu/~cfadd/1150/15Period/Vert.html
 
Achh! I think I got it! I had calculus physics quite a while ago, and your clue about free-body diagram reminded me that work done is just integral of force over distance. In this situation force of gravity F = mg just changes equilibrium position, and the net force is still F = kx, where x is the distance from new equilibrium position. Given that, integral of force over distance results in the same gains of potential energy 1/2 kx^2, so it is all ok :)

Did I got it correctly?
 
Pretty much - you can also do it from Newton's laws:

If you measure position down from the attachment point ...
- when the spring is not stretched the mass is at position ##y=u##
- when at equilibrium, the mass is lower down at ##y=e##
- stretch the spring to ##y=y_0> e## and let it go ... at ##t>0##, ##y(t)## satisfies:
##mg-k(y-u) = m\ddot y## (1)

But the equilibrium position is determined by ##k(e-u)=mg \implies ku = ke-mg## ... substitute into (1) above to give:
##-k(y-e)=m\ddot y## (2)

which is the same equation as you get for the horizontal mass and spring, with e replacing u.
The solution looks like: ##y(t) = e + (y_0-e)\cos\omega t##
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
Replies
7
Views
3K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
1K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
2K
Replies
7
Views
1K
Replies
25
Views
1K
Replies
3
Views
981
Replies
44
Views
7K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
4K