Transition Matrix and Ordered Bases

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of transition matrices between ordered bases in ℝn, specifically how to derive the transition matrix from one basis to another using matrix representations of the bases. Participants explore definitions, notations, and the relationships between the bases and their corresponding matrices.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that the transition matrix from basis B to basis C can be expressed as Q-1P, where P and Q are matrices formed by the basis vectors.
  • Another participant questions how to define the transition matrix and suggests two possible definitions involving matrix M, leading to a discussion about whether M should be defined as fi = Σ Mij ej or fi = M ei.
  • A participant expresses confusion regarding the notation of the matrix and how to rewrite rows and columns, indicating a need for clarification on matrix representation.
  • Another participant introduces a notation for matrix elements, suggesting the use of Aij for elements and Ai for rows, which may aid in understanding the matrix structure.
  • A participant discusses representing vectors in terms of basis vectors and how to express linear transformations using matrices, illustrating this with an example of matrix multiplication and its implications for representing transformations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants have not reached a consensus on the definitions and implications of the transition matrix. There are multiple competing views on how to approach the problem, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the clarity of notation and definitions being used, which may affect participants' understanding of the transition matrix and its derivation. The discussion also highlights the dependence on specific definitions of basis and matrix operations.

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Let B and C be ordered bases for ℝn. Let P be the matrix whose columns are the vectors in B and let Q be the matrix whose columns are the vectors in C. Prove that the transition matrix from B to C equals Q-1P.


I am stuck. Here is what I have.

I know that if B is the standard basis in ℝn, then the transition matrix from B to C is given by [1st vector in C 2nd vector in C ... nth vector in C]-1.

Also, if C is a standard basis in ℝn, then the transition matrix from B to C is given by [1st vector in B 2 vector in B ... nth vector in B].

Since I konw what the transition matrix is from B to C given different standard bases, I am having a difficult time relating this to the columns of each.
 
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You're going to need a notation for the basis vectors. I suggest
\begin{align} B&=\{e_1,\dots,e_n\}\\
C &=\{f_1,\dots,f_n\}
\end{align} How do you define the transition matrix from B to C? Is it the M defined by
$$f_i=\sum_j M_{ij} e_j$$ or the M defined by
$$f_i=Me_i=\sum_j (Me_i)_j e_j=\sum_j M_{ji} e_j?$$ (The latter M is the transpose of the former). You want to prove that (with one of these choices of M), we have ##M=Q^{-1}P##. This is equivalent to ##QM=P##, which is equivalent to ##P_{ij}=(QM)_{ij}=##what? Use the definition of matrix multiplication to rewrite ##(QM)_{ij}##. Then you can start thinking about rows and columns.
 
Im confused with the notation of the matrix. How do you rewrite the rows and columns
 
I'm not sure if you're asking about what I did or about the problem.

One notation that can be useful is to denote the number on row i, column j of a matrix A by ##A^i_j## instead of ##A_{ij}##. Then you can just denote the ith row by ##A^i##.

So for example, we have ##P_i=e_i## for all i.
 
If we have basis [itex]\{u_1, u_2, \cdot\cdot\cdot, u_n\}[/itex] for vector space U, then we can represent a vector [itex]u= a_1u_1+ a_2u_2+ \cdot\cdot\cdot+ a_nu_n[/itex] as the array [itex]\left<a_1, a_2, \cdot\cdot\cdot, a_n\right>[/itex].
In particular the basis vectors themselves are very easy:
[itex]u_1= \left< 1, 0, \cdot\cdot\cdot, 0\right>[/itex]
[itex]u_2= \left<0, 1, \cdot\cdot\cdot, 0\right>[/itex]
... [itex]u_n= \left<0, 0, \cdot\cdot\cdot, 1\right>[/itex]
Now, look at what when you multiply each of those, written as a column by a matrix:
Multiplying [itex]u_1[/itex] gives just the first column, multiplying [itex]u_2[/itex] gives the second column, etc.
Example:
[tex]\begin{bmatrix}a_{11} & a_{12} & a_{13} \\ a_{21} & a_{22} & a_{23} \\ a_{31} & a_{32} & a_{33}\end{bmatrix}\begin{bmatrix}0 \\ 1 \\ 0 \end{bmatrix}= \begin{bmatrix}a_{12} \\ a_{22} \\ a_{32}\end{bmatrix}[/tex]
which will then be the coefficients of the expansion of Au in whatever basis we are using for the range space. That is, to represent linear transformation A from U to V, using a given ordered basis for each, apply A to each basis vector for U in turn, writing the result as a linear combination of the basis vectors for V. The coefficients of that linear combination will be the columns of the matrix representation.
 
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