Trying to understand the oscillation of electrons in the magnetic fiel

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the oscillation of electrons in the Earth's magnetic field, specifically exploring the mechanics of electron motion, the role of electric and magnetic fields, and the factors influencing the reduction of the parallel velocity component of the electron's motion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the oscillation of an electron in the magnetic field may be influenced by the convergence of magnetic field lines, which could simulate a changing magnetic field and induce an electric field that dampens the electron's motion.
  • Another participant emphasizes that in the Earth's frame, the electron experiences a Lorentz force due to the magnetic field without the involvement of electric fields, while in the electron's frame, an electric component arises.
  • A participant acknowledges the dual perspective of viewing the situation from either the Earth's frame or the electron's frame but expresses difficulty in understanding the electron's frame.
  • It is noted that the parallel component of the electron's velocity is not lost but can be reduced due to increased field strength or collisions with other particles.
  • One participant questions the underlying physics behind the reduction of the parallel component and seeks further explanation, referencing a document that discusses the phenomenon in terms of a dipole.
  • Another participant proposes that increasing field strength leads to an inward component of the magnetic field, which could exert a net force that affects the electron's velocity component orthogonal to this inward direction.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying views on the mechanisms behind the oscillation and reduction of the parallel component, indicating that multiple competing perspectives remain without a clear consensus.

Contextual Notes

Some discussions involve transformations between reference frames and the implications of field strength changes, but the specific conditions and assumptions underlying these transformations are not fully resolved.

hb1547
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Working on understanding the physics of how an electron oscillates along the Earth's magnetic field. I understand that an electron will spiral around the magnetic field line, that's easy to tell from the Lorentz force. What I don't understand is what causes the oscillation.

My best guess is that, as the magnetic field lines come close together as they come close to the Earth, this simulates a changing magnetic field from the electron's view, and induces an electric field in the direction that would dampen the electron's motion and reverse it. What's giving me a hard time is understanding specifically how an electric field is created in that direction.

Any insight or tips?
 
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Electromagnetic fields depend on your reference frame.

In the frame of earth, we have a magnetic field, and an electron with a component perpendicular to that field -> Lorentz force. No electric fields are involved.
If you transform this field into the frame of the electron, the field gets an electric component, leading to the same force.
 
mfb said:
Electromagnetic fields depend on your reference frame.

In the frame of earth, we have a magnetic field, and an electron with a component perpendicular to that field -> Lorentz force. No electric fields are involved.
If you transform this field into the frame of the electron, the field gets an electric component, leading to the same force.

Yes, this makes sense, and I know I can think of it either as purely magnetic (Earth's frame) or as an electric field (electron's frame). I thought the electron's frame would be easier but it hasn't been.

Then to me it seems that perhaps the converging of the magnetic field lines might help to explain why the parallel component of the velocity is lost, but I'm still having trouble.
 
The parallel component is not lost, but it can get reduced if the field strength increases, or the particle collides with other particles.
 
mfb said:
The parallel component is not lost, but it can get reduced if the field strength increases, or the particle collides with other particles.

Yes, but what is the physics behind the reduction in the parallel component? Why does it reduce?

I found http://faculty.uml.edu/cbaird/95.657%282012%29/Ionosphere.pdf, which explains it well in terms of a dipole, but perhaps there's an explanation in terms of just the particle?
 
hb1547 said:
Yes, but what is the physics behind the reduction in the parallel component? Why does it reduce?
Increasing field strength correspond to an "inwards" component of the magnetic field (into the spiral). The velocity component orthogonal to this component gives a net force backwards, if I rotated those coordinates correctly.
 

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