Understanding Gravity at Long Distances

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Deepak K Kapur
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    Gravity
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the nature of gravitational influence at long distances, specifically addressing how stars in constellations and galaxies can interact despite vast separations. Participants explore theoretical implications and conceptual understandings of gravity in both stellar and galactic contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that stars in constellations do not have significant gravitational influence on each other due to their vast distances, suggesting that constellations are merely patterns perceived by the human mind.
  • Others argue that while individual stars have minimal influence, the overall gravitational effects of many stars in a galaxy contribute to its structure and dynamics over long periods.
  • A participant mentions that gravitational attraction does not have a limit in range, implying that even distant stars can exert some influence, albeit weakly.
  • Some contributions highlight that the gravitational effects of galaxies on each other are small and primarily result in slight deviations in their paths over time.
  • One participant raises a question about the nature of gravity, suggesting that if gravity is classical and not quantum mechanical, it may not allow for significant influence between stars or galaxies that are extremely far apart.
  • Another participant notes that the gravitational force from nearby masses can be greater than that from distant stars, challenging intuitive expectations about gravitational influence.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a mix of agreement and disagreement regarding the nature and extent of gravitational influence at large distances. While some acknowledge that gravity operates over vast scales, others question the significance of this influence when distances become exceedingly large.

Contextual Notes

Participants discuss the limitations of gravitational influence based on distance, with some suggesting that gravitational effects may become negligible beyond certain ranges. The conversation also touches on the implications of viewing gravity through the lens of spacetime curvature, raising further questions about the nature of gravitational interactions.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to individuals exploring concepts in astrophysics, cosmology, and gravitational theory, particularly those curious about the interactions of celestial bodies over vast distances.

  • #31
Deepak K Kapur said:
I have spent quite a lot of time on virtual particles (via Google) and have reached at surprising conclusions as follows:
1.
An electron and positron approach each other. It is told that they exchange virtual particles and thus get attracted.

I simply don't get this. If they throw virtual particles (that transfer the momentum) at each other, they should be repelled and not attracted.


etc. etc.

[/B]

You need to pause, at this stage. Consider why the theories of fundamental particles, QM and Relativity have presented so many problems and difficulties to so many really clever brains, over the years. If it really were as simple as you seem to want, then it would be within the capabilities of any schoolchild to understand it all.
You are trying to interpret what you have been reading in terms that were already familiar to you. You read the word 'particle' and you immediately think it must be like a little bullet. That is very far from the case. Personally, I feel that the word 'particle' was an unfortunate choice (back to the corpuscular theory of light). I guess that some of the original properties that are attributed to photons made it an attractive term to use but people, fresh to the subject, all carry the name and the analogy too far.
To increase the level of confusion, the term 'virtual photon' was then introduced - as a natural extension. This makes life even more difficult. The concept of particles flinging other particles at each other as they go past is a tempting one but, as you have shown, it leads people even deeper into the mire of misunderstanding.
You will stand a much better chance of getting to know a bit more about all this is if you use the word 'particle' in mental inverted commas, whenever it's in the context of advanced Physics. That will remind you that you just cannot make assumptions about how it will behave on the grounds of how bullets and snooker balls behave. Follow all the rules of advanced Physics and don't ever try to think in terms of Classical Mechanics and everyday experience. This will be very hard. It's hard for everyone and there is no easy way into this.
 
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  • #32
This thread is all over the map. It's no longer about the original topic, and I sense a growing frustration with people trying to answer the OP's questions - which seem to be at least partially uncoupled to the answers.
 

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