Understanding Semi-Direct Products in Group Theory and Lie Algebras

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concept of semi-direct products in group theory and their relation to direct products, particularly in the context of Lie groups and Lie algebras. Participants are exploring the conditions under which a group can be expressed as a direct product of two subgroups and the implications of these conditions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that a group G is a direct product of two groups if it contains normal subgroups N_1 and N_2 such that N_1 ∩ N_2 = {e} and G = N_1 N_2, questioning the necessity of the normality condition.
  • Another participant points out that the condition N_1 ∩ N_2 = {e} ensures uniqueness of the decomposition but questions why the subgroups must be normal, asking what occurs if they are not.
  • A third participant references a standard theorem stating that if H and K are normal subgroups of G with H ∩ K = {e}, then HK is isomorphic to H × K, suggesting that the normality condition is significant for this result.
  • The initial poster acknowledges understanding the converse of the theorem but remains unclear on the necessity of normality in the context of direct products.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty regarding the necessity of normal subgroups in the definition of direct products, indicating that multiple views exist on this aspect of the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not resolved the question of the normality condition and its implications for the structure of groups and their decompositions.

haushofer
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Hi,

I try to get a grasp on semi-direct products, by notes written by Patrick J. Morandi ("Semi direct products"). I see that the notion of a semi-direct product is more general than a direct product.

However, the author states that

A group G is a direct product of two groups iff G contains normal subgroups [itex]N_1[/itex] and [itex]N_2[/itex] such that [itex]N_1\cap N_2 = \{e\}[/itex] and [itex]G= N_1 N_2[/itex].

Why is this exactly the case?

And also, how can I translate this for Lie groups on the level of the Lie algebra? (For instance, for the Poincare group). If someone knows good notes or a textbook I'm happy to be informed also :)
 
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I see that

[itex] N_1\cap N_2 = \{e\}[/itex]
gives that the decomposition is unique, but I don't see why the subgroups have to be normal. What happens if they're not?
 
It is a standard theorem in group theory that if [tex]H[/tex] and [tex]K[/tex] are normal subgroups of [tex]G[/tex] and [tex]H\cap K=\{e\}[/tex], then [tex]HK\cong H\times K[/tex].

see e.g. http://homepage.mac.com/ehgoins/ma553/lecture_21.pdf ("recognition theorem").

You can probably prove the converse for yourself. (just think of {(h,e)|h\in H} and {(e,k)|k\in K})
 
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Ok, thanks! Yes, the converse is quite clear to me I guess, but I don't see clearly why these subgroups have to be normal. I'll check your link, thanks again! :)
 

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