Understanding the Fundamental Frequency f1 and Its Role in Sound Waves

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter toesockshoe
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the fundamental frequency \( f_1 \) of vibrating strings and its relationship to sound waves, exploring concepts of sound perception, harmonic modes, and the physical behavior of strings in musical instruments. The scope includes theoretical and conceptual aspects of sound production and perception.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question whether sound waves have modes, noting that while strings vibrate at multiple frequencies, the perception of sound is dominated by the fundamental frequency \( f_1 \).
  • Others argue that while the fundamental frequency is perceived, higher frequencies contribute to the timbre of the sound, and all frequencies are present when a string is struck.
  • It is suggested that the decay of higher modes occurs more rapidly than that of the fundamental, leading to a predominance of \( f_1 \) over time.
  • Some participants discuss the initial conditions of string vibration, describing how the shape of the string influences the modes present at the start of vibration.
  • There is a question about whether normal modes disappear in reverse numerical order, indicating uncertainty about the damping process of different modes.
  • One participant mentions the influence of the geometry of the setup on the damping of higher energy modes.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the perception of sound frequencies and the behavior of vibrating strings, with no consensus reached on the specifics of how modes interact or decay over time.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include assumptions about the listener's perception of sound and the specific conditions under which strings vibrate, as well as unresolved details regarding the mathematical modeling of mode decay.

toesockshoe
Messages
265
Reaction score
2
My book says "the sound produces by vibrating strings is likewise a superposition of traveling sinusoidal sound waves, which you perceive as a rich, complex tone with the fundamental frequency f_1. I know this is the normal mode on a string... but sound waves don't have modes right? Also does this mean we can't here strings that vibrate at f_2 or f_3 or so on?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
It doesn't mean that we only hear the fundamental, but we perceive the note as the fundamental. You hear all of the other frequencies, but they are perceived as timbre or color. If you strike a guitar string, it vibrates at ##f_1## and many (many) other frequencies. Certain higher frequencies die out more quickly which give the guitar its characteristic tone. To the best of my knowledge it is more of an artifact of our brain that we hear the note as ##f_1##. There is obviously a lot more to it that just that, but I think that might start to answer your question.
 
The string vibrates however it is set up to vibrate, it's motion disturbs the air making sound waves there - which reach your ears.
If the string is vibrating at f2 you will hear whatever that note is (give the limits of hearing). You can set up a string with a multivibrator and see/hear it - there are examples online.

You will have noticed that the string, once set in motion, does not keep vibrating - if you strike a string, or pluck it, what you start out with is a combination of many modes. The higher modes die off faster than the lower ones so you are left with the fundamental.

Other modes may last longer in a musical instrument, that's part of how they are made and it is why different instruments playing the same note sound different.
 
Simon Bridge said:
The string vibrates however it is set up to vibrate, it's motion disturbs the air making sound waves there - which reach your ears.
If the string is vibrating at f2 you will hear whatever that note is (give the limits of hearing). You can set up a string with a multivibrator and see/hear it - there are examples online.

You will have noticed that the string, once set in motion, does not keep vibrating - if you strike a string, or pluck it, what you start out with is a combination of many modes. The higher modes die off faster than the lower ones so you are left with the fundamental.

What do you mean once set in motion, does not keep vibrating? that is set in motion, but the vibrations go on. or do you mean if it is set in motion, then you turn off the multivibrator? if you turn it off, then the vibrator is staying still so is pulling the string to equilibrium ... right?
 
If you pluck or strike a string, as in a musical instrument, it vibrates for a while and then stops.
In fact, pull the string up and release it and you will see, just before the release, the string makes a triangle shape ... it is being set up in an initial condition where the sum of the modes is that triangle. A sort while after release you will see it is basically the fundamental that is left.
 
Simon Bridge said:
If you pluck or strike a string, as in a musical instrument, it vibrates for a while and then stops.
In fact, pull the string up and release it and you will see, just before the release, the string makes a triangle shape ... it is being set up in an initial condition where the sum of the modes is that triangle. A sort while after release you will see it is basically the fundamental that is left.
so does each normal mode disappear in reverse numerical order?
 
It depends on the precise geometry of the setup.
For a string like in the video I'd expect higher energy modes to damp out faster.

The concepts you want to look up are:
resonance
harmonic oscillator: driven and damped.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 40 ·
2
Replies
40
Views
5K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
4K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
6K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 92 ·
4
Replies
92
Views
6K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
Replies
6
Views
1K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K