Unraveling the Mystery: Why Does the Bottle Shrink?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the phenomenon of a bottle or can shrinking when subjected to temperature changes, particularly in the context of pressure changes as described by Gay-Lussac's law. Participants explore the relationship between internal and external pressures, the effects of atmospheric pressure, and the role of water vapor in the pressure dynamics during heating and cooling processes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants reference Gay-Lussac's law, noting that as temperature decreases, pressure also decreases, but question how this relates to the volume of the bottle.
  • One participant asserts that the external atmospheric pressure exerts a force on the bottle, leading to its shrinkage when internal pressure drops.
  • There is a discussion about whether the external pressure exceeds the internal pressure, which some participants agree upon.
  • Participants inquire about the pressure inside the can before and after heating, questioning why the can does not expand when heated if the pressure was initially at 1 atm.
  • One participant explains that when the can is heated, gases can escape, and the pressure equilibrates with the external environment, leading to rapid pressure drops when cooled.
  • Another participant expresses skepticism about the experiment's explanation, suggesting that the dynamics involve condensation of water rather than solely cooling of gas, which complicates the understanding of the pressure changes.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that external atmospheric pressure plays a significant role in the bottle's shrinkage, but there is disagreement regarding the applicability of Gay-Lussac's law and the underlying physics of the pressure changes during the experiment. The discussion remains unresolved on the precise mechanisms at play.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight limitations in the explanations provided, noting that the role of water vapor and the conditions under which the experiment is conducted may not be fully accounted for, leading to potential misunderstandings of the pressure dynamics involved.

gracy
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why the bottle shrinks?(1)I know according to Gay lussac law Temperature ∝ pressure, as temperature decreases pressure also decreases .But why bottle would shrink if pressure decreases,because decreases in pressure just mean molecules are not hitting that fast.
(2)And if bottle shrinks it's volume no longer remain constant so how can gay lussac law explain this.Because according to gay lussac law volume should remain constant.
 
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Pressure is a force exerted on the surface. When the pressure inside goes down external force crushes the bottle.
 
Borek said:
external force
Which one?
 
That of the atmosphere. You are forgetting we are being squeezed by the 1 atm of the atmospheric pressure all the time. It doesn't matter when the bottle contains the air at the same pressure, but when you remove the air from the bottle, situation changes.
 
Borek said:
That of the atmosphere. You are forgetting we are being squeezed by the 1 atm of the atmospheric pressure all the time. It doesn't matter when the bottle contains the air at the same pressure, but when you remove the air from the bottle, situation changes.
You mean external pressure>internal pressure that's why bottle shrinks.
 
Yes.
 
Borek said:
Yes.
So in this video before the bottle or can is put in cold water ,the pressure inside was 1 atm?
 
Yes. It quickly drops down when the can is cooled down.
 
gracy said:
So in this video before the bottle or can is put in cold water ,the pressure inside was 1 atm?
But why?
Borek said:
Yes. It quickly drops down when the can is cooled down.
When can cooled down ,pressure dropped down from 1 atm,so when can was heated at 0:40-0:50 seconds in this video pressure should have increased from 1 atm,right?So why didn't the can expand?
 
  • #10
Can is opened, so when it is heated gases have no problems evacuating, and the pressure inside is the same as a pressure around. Then they put the can to water with the opening directed down, so when the pressure inside the can drops down rapidly, it starts to suck water. But the water is a dense liquid, and it can't be sucked up as fast as the gas could be - so before the pressure equilibrates, forces acting on the can have enough time to do the damage.

To be honest, I don't like this experiment, as the explanation of what is happening is far from obvious.
 
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  • #11
Borek said:
Can is opened, so when it is heated gases have no problems evacuating, and the pressure inside is the same as a pressure around. Then they put the can to water with the opening directed down, so when the pressure inside the can drops down rapidly, it starts to suck water. But the water is a dense liquid, and it can't be sucked up as fast as the gas could be - so before the pressure equilibrates, forces acting on the can have enough time to do the damage.

To be honest, I don't like this experiment, as the explanation of what is happening is far from obvious.
Thanks.Very nice explanation.
 
  • #12
Also note that it is not about Gay Lussac law (which is why I don't like the experiment). It may look like that's what is going on, but they added some water to the can. That means after heating boiling water purged most of the air from the can (the water vapor pressure was still making the inside pressure up to 1 atm). When they put the can into water what is happening is not the cooling of the gas, but condensation of the water. Net effect - inside pressure dropping down fast and external pressure crushing the can - is the same, but the physics behind the pressure drop is different from what they want you to think it is.
 
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