News US Vice President Cheney Accidentally Shoots Fellow Hunter

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Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot and injured Harry Whittington during a quail hunting trip in Texas, with Whittington reported to be recovering well. The incident raised concerns about Cheney's recklessness and potential legal liability for the shooting, as some believe he failed to ensure the safety of those around him before firing. Discussions also highlighted the responsibilities of hunting groups to communicate and maintain awareness of each other's locations to prevent accidents. The role of Secret Service agents present during the incident was questioned, as they are expected to monitor safety in such situations. Overall, the incident sparked debates about gun safety and the implications of careless firearm use.
  • #31
It doesn't surprise me they held off on any formal announcement of the incident...first get the story straight, then make sure the guy he shot is doing okay so they can put that in the press release. 24 hours isn't really that long to get an official statement on something.
 
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  • #32
Actually this was a fortunate incident compared to three years ago when Cheney/Bush shot the entire country in the foot. One more screw up like Iraq and we won't have a leg to stand on.:smile: :wink:
 
  • #33
Seems to me like both of them are at fault. The guy that got shot should have never NEVER been ahead of the shooters, and Cheney should have been sure of his shot and not blindly shooting like some sort of idiot. Any of this stuff is taught in an BASIC hunter education course, not to mention just common sense. You never go ahead unless you are sure you are clear.
 
  • #34
Loren Booda said:
It doesn't take a hunter to be concerned about the similarity between Cheney's reckless use of a shotgun and his potential responsibility for launching thousands of conventional or thermonuclear bombs.
Oh my god, you're right! Quick, run for the bunkers before the nuclear holocaust is started!
Personally I think he was ordered to kill old people. Think about it, they want to screw up medicaid, social security, retirment pay from big corporations, etc. However, not enough are dying to please them, so Cheney was ordered to shoot the old rancher. So remeber this, if you're an old person and get an invitation to go hunting with the VP, hide as quickly as you can. Your very life might be at stake.
 
  • #35
Archon,

You mean he pulled the trigger without assessing the situation and there were unexpected civilian casualties?

Kinda like the Iraq war huh? Funny the victim was so quick to exonerate Cheney and claim fault. (Think he was scared it would be something else he would be shot with besides birdshot if he didn't?)
 
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  • #36
Amp1 said:
Funny the victim was so quick to exonerate Cheney and claim fault. (Think he was scared it would be something besides birdshot if he didn't?)
Damn right he was scared! Cheney already tried to murder him once, you just know that he wouldn't hesitate to kill him for something so apparently simple as a hunting accident. I mean, we all know how pure evil this administration is, I wouldn't put anything past them! I bet Cheney was sitting next to his hospital bed, whispering into his ear of all the terrible things that would happen to his family if he blamed the VP.
 
  • #37
Yep, I wonder sometimes why former Sec. of State Powell didn't clarify his statements that he attempted to reason with the Prez about invading Iraq. And why he offered what he must have obviously knew was flawed data of WMDs in Iraq. (He was the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the main commander behind 'OP Desert Storm, I can't fathom how he could not have been aware of the state of Saddam's WMDs when DS was finished. In fact, I think he said publicly the they had smashed Saddam's military and destroyed his WMD capability.)

Sorry I've gone OT.
 
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  • #38
Dawguard said:
Damn right he was scared!
Calm down minion of the Bush cult.

McClellan grilled on Cheney news

White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan is in the thick of a more-interesting-than-usual briefing right now. Reporters have repeatedly asked about Vice President Dick Cheney's accidental shooting of a hunting companion, with a major focus on the timeline of events.

As Fishbowl DC and others note, there's a substantial gap in the time between the shooting -- Saturday afternoon -- and the news of the shooting -- Sunday. Also, there's the fact that the news came from the ranch's owner, Katharine Armstrong, instead of from the White House or the vice president's office.
http://blogs.usatoday.com/ondeadline/2006/02/mcclellan_grill.html

As stated earlier, this accident should be viewed only as material for comedians. However, as usual it won’t be because Bush, et al can’t come clean right up front with one damn thing.

...official confirmation of the shooting came about only after a local reporter in Corpus Christi, Texas, received a tip from the owner of the property where the shooting occurred and called Vice President Cheney's office for confirmation.

The confirmation was made but it is not known for certain that Cheney's office, the White House, or anyone else intended to announce the shooting if the reporter, Jaime Powell of the Corpus Christ Caller-Times, had not received word from the ranch owner.
How many believe the announcement would have been initiated by the White House?
 
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  • #39
Nope, they wouldn't have uttered a peep. the ranch owner probably reasoned that it was safer to get the incident made public rather than some unforseen accident decimate her family, IMO. the admin will probably clamp a classified lid on the rest heading off any further release of details, like for instance what the sort of conversation was going on at the time and what the veeps state of mind was in the moments prior to the accident.
 
  • #40
You should know that the husband of the ranch owner was a director of Halliburton when Cheney was hired as CEO. When she says things to minimize the idiocy of the shooting like "I got peppered good once" or similar things, remember the source.
 
  • #41
SOS2008 said:
Calm down minion of the Bush cult.
Minion? Of the Bush cult? I hate the Bush cult: along with pretty much every other politician out there. I was just mocking the extremists who are ready to believe anything bad about the right wing. I mean, do you really think that Bush would have killed the hunter just to prevent the story from getting out? Come on, quit the conspiracy theories, it was a simple accident.
 
  • #42
I'm sorry, but what kind of MORON accidentally shoots someone? I don't understand how that can even happen. Yet it happens.

EDIT: To set it clear, I'm not against Dick Cheney, just against his firearm safety incompetence.
 
  • #43
Dawguard said:
Minion? Of the Bush cult? I hate the Bush cult: along with pretty much every other politician out there. I was just mocking the extremists who are ready to believe anything bad about the right wing. I mean, do you really think that Bush would have killed the hunter just to prevent the story from getting out? Come on, quit the conspiracy theories, it was a simple accident.
Fair enough about conspiracy theories. At the same time, the Bush administration has done nothing to create a warm and fuzzy feeling of trust, so suspicion will abound.
 
  • #44
moose said:
I'm sorry, but what kind of MORON accidentally shoots someone? I don't understand how that can even happen. Yet it happens.

EDIT: To set it clear, I'm not against Dick Cheney, just against his firearm safety incompetence.

Firearms accidents happen very frequently. This incident is the first time that I have seen Cheney look almost human.:wink:
 
  • #45
edward said:
Firearms accidents happen very frequently. This incident is the first time that I have seen Cheney look almost human.:wink:


Firearm accidents usually happen by idiots. The reason why it seems impossible to shoot someone accidentally is because... why would you be aiming somewhere even close to a human?
 
  • #46
He didn't have the right permits either:

The Parks and Wildlife Department said Cheney and Whittington will be given warning citations for violating game law by not having an upland game bird stamp, a requirement that went into effect in September. Cheney had a $125 nonresident hunting license, the vice president's office said Monday night in a statement, and has sent a $7 check to cover the cost of the stamp.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060214/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cheney_hunting_accident_38;_ylt=Ak2g2PxKzg1BbbwZKy8rxdJqP0AC;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl"

I think this borders on absurd...
 
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  • #47
Someone should lock this thread already. What a bunch of nonsense seriously. Stop posting in here people, this is the political forum. This thread has turned into let's tell jokes and give our opinions on shooting. It was ok for the first 2 pages, now its just beating a dead horse.
 
  • #48
edward said:
Firearms accidents happen very frequently. This incident is the first time that I have seen Cheney look almost human.:wink:
Firearms "accidents" are almost always due to the failure of the firearms users failure to use due diligence. I have been hunting for over 40 years and have not yet shot another person. If you have a different standard of excellence, I pity the people who accompany you on a hunt.
 
  • #49
Ivan Seeking said:
you could still be hit with wreckless endagerment, or some similar charge.

:smile: Make that reckless negligence!

I think wreckless negligence is a driving offense. :biggrin:
 
  • #50
Dear God Lock The Thread Ivan!


:)
 
  • #51
Pengwuino said:
Aren't quail slow and fat though??
No, that's Quayle ! :biggrin:
 
  • #52
turbo-1 said:
Firearms "accidents" are almost always due to the failure of the firearms users failure to use due diligence. I have been hunting for over 40 years and have not yet shot another person. If you have a different standard of excellence, I pity the people who accompany you on a hunt.
How many people has Cheney shot before this? It's at least 50-50 that he had you beat for number of years hunting without shooting someone ... at least until last weekend.

Yes, the accidents are almost always the fault of the shooter. Mistakes by the shootee may make it easier for the shooter to make a mistake, but it's still the shooter's mistake. But anyone can make a mistake. The best you can say is that you've been shooting for over 40 years and haven't shot a person ... yet.

The flap over who told the press and when is ridiculous. This isn't exactly the kind of story that warranted "we interrupt your regularly scheduled program". The fact that there is an issue about how the info was released is pretty indicative of how low politics has fallen.
 
  • #53
rachmaninoff said:
He didn't have the right permits either:


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060214/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cheney_hunting_accident_38;_ylt=Ak2g2PxKzg1BbbwZKy8rxdJqP0AC;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl"

I think this borders on absurd...

In and of itself it's nothing. But it is sooooo classic that Cheney would hunt illegally; to act as if above the law.

It seems that the shooting victim has had a heart attack. There may be a pellet near the heart.
 
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  • #54
Ivan Seeking said:
It seems that the shooting victim has had a heart attack. There may be a pellet near the heart.
That would explain why he started out in the ICU. The first round of news out on the story sounded like the guy was hurt, but not seriously...just superficial type skin wounds, but then yesterday's stories were saying the guy was OUT of ICU and stable, which implied he had not been stable on arrival and the injuries were serious enough to warrant being sent to ICU in the first place. It would also explain the delays between the time of shooting and getting the guy to the hospital if it was serious enough that they were trying to stabilize him on the scene, which was another oddity in the initial reports. And, it definitely explains the delay in reporting...if the guy is in ICU and you don't know if he's going to live or die, I can totally understand the press office waiting to see which way it was going to go before making any official statement. I mean, it's a very different story if the VP killed somebody in a hunting accident vs shot him and he's stable and recovering well. Personally, I don't have a problem with them waiting a day on this. I didn't really need regular programming interrupted with round-the-clock coverage of "The VP shot someone and that's all we know, but we're going to keep interrupting regularly scheduled programming to remind you of that every half hour."
 
  • #55
I noticed the same thing about the ICU business... thought maybe this was just over-compensation due to Cheney's involvement.
 
  • #56
What if he dies?
 
  • #57
What is the implication if the victim dies? What offense would the VP be charged with, and would he have to resign?
 
  • #58
Originally Posted by edward
Firearms accidents happen very frequently. This incident is the first time that I have seen Cheney look almost human.

turbo-1 said:
Firearms "accidents" are almost always due to the failure of the firearms users failure to use due diligence. I have been hunting for over 40 years and have not yet shot another person. If you have a different standard of excellence, I pity the people who accompany you on a hunt.

And I have been hunting for over 50 years without shooting someone. My post was an attempt at dry humor which you apparently misunderstood.:smile: Cheney normally live in a real of secrecy.

BTW the guy cheney shot has now suffered a heart attack believed to have been brought about by pellets in his heart.
http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/2006/02/14/whittington-heart060114.html
 
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  • #59
Orefa said:
What is the implication if the victim dies? What offense would the VP be charged with, and would he have to resign?
I think you've hit on the important question here, and the reason this becomes so newsworthy. I think that's also why, in the reports out so far, the local law enforcement officers make a point of noting that alcohol was not involved, because alcohol would have suggested negligence (just like killing someone while drunk driving). If it is determined this was a foreseeable or preventable accident, and the victim dies, there could be charges of negligent homicide. I think that's the importance of the ongoing police investigation, to determine if there was real negligence to bring up such a charge, or if it really wasn't something the VP could have predicted or avoided. I also think that's the highest offense it could be. Unintentional manslaughter would have required he had been made aware of the risk and went ahead and did something risky anyway... or at least that's my understanding of the distinction. If someone here is more familiar with the legal definitions of negligent homicide vs unintentional manslaughter, I will defer to them.

Part II to your question is whether he would have to resign if that happened. Again, if someone knows better than me on this, step in, but I don't think he would have to resign unless convicted. On the other hand, would he be pressured to resign voluntarily if a criminal trial interferred with his ability to perform his duties? I certainly don't know the answer to that, but suspect that at the very least, his political opponents would make a call for his resignation.
 
  • #60
edward said:
And I have been hunting for over 50 years without shooting someone. My post was an attempt at dry humor which you apparently misunderstood.:smile:
Please accept my apology. Bird hunting is generally a quick-response activity (quick flushes, large angular sweeps on the part of the targets), and because of that it requires extra diligence and awareness on the part of the shooter. I hunt ruffed grouse without the use of dogs, and in cold weather they hold cover until you are almost on top of them, then explode out of cover. This kind of hunting would be very dangerous if you were hunting in a group in which some members were not cognizant of the dangers and the ways to avoid them. I have hunted this way with friends and family members all my life and have never shot anyone, nor been shot, nor know of any of the group who has shot another person.

Many of the recent press releases stress that Dick Cheney is an "experienced hunter". If he had grown up in my family or in my home town, his "experience" would have been exemplified by his ability to put some food in the freezer. The fact that a millionaire frequently gets invited to game ranches and gets to shoot at animals does not make him "experienced".
 

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