Use Wronskian to show only 2 indepndent solutions of 2nd order ODE

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around using the Wronskian to demonstrate that a second-order ordinary differential equation (ODE) cannot have three independent solutions. Participants explore the implications of the Wronskian determinant and the properties of the solutions to the ODE.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a method to show that if there are three solutions to the ODE, the Wronskian must vanish for all x, implying linear dependence.
  • The participant calculates the Wronskian determinant and expresses uncertainty about the implications of certain terms, particularly the second derivatives of the solutions.
  • Another participant suggests substituting the expressions for the second derivatives of the solutions based on the ODE itself, indicating that this approach might simplify the problem.
  • A later reply acknowledges the usefulness of the suggestion and reflects on the importance of recognizing that the functions are solutions to the ODE.
  • One participant expresses frustration about missing obvious steps and appreciates the support from the forum in overcoming challenges in understanding the problem.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the approach of using the Wronskian but have not reached a consensus on the best method to demonstrate the claim regarding the independence of solutions. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specific steps to take.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the assumptions made about the second derivatives and the potential complexity of the solutions, which may affect the conclusions drawn from the Wronskian.

ognik
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Given standard ODE $ y'' + P(x)y' + Q(x)y=0 $, use wronskian to show it cannot have 3 independent sltns. Assume a 3rd solution and show W vanishes for all x.

so 1st row of W = {$ {y}_{1}, {y}_{2},{y}_{3} $}, 2nd row is 1st derivatives, 3rd row is 2nd derivatives.

I can find the determinate, W (should it be written as |W| ?) = $ y_1 y'_2y''_3 - y_1y''_2y'_3 - y_2y'_1y''_3 + y_2y''_1y'_3 + y_3y'_1y''_2 - y_3y''_1y'_2 $

I know that $ y_1y'_2 - y_2y'_1 \ne 0 $(IE $y_3$ is the 'other' solution), so I grouped the above into $ y''_3(y_1y'_2 - y_2y'_1) - y''_2(y_1y'_3 - y_3y'_1) - y''_1(y_2y'_3 - y_3y'_1) $. The terms in brackets are Wronskians and if the 3 solutions are linearly independent, then they cannot=0. It would be convenient then, to have the 2nd derivatives = 0, but I can't argue that as the y(x)'s could have $x^2$ terms...

I have tried various other combinations, but most of them just transform to expansions by a different row/column. Can anyone give me a hint please?
 
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Assuming your Wronskian is correct, maybe you could substitute $y_2''=-P(x) y_2'-Q(x) y_2$, and the same for the other two solutions?
 
... and they all cancel neatly, I wish I could think of these obvious-in-retrospect approaches.
 
Well, in this case, what led me to that suggestion was that, so far, you had not used the fact that the functions were solutions. That had to be important.
 
I also thought it important, but instead thought that suggested using the Wronskian, I think with a lot more practice it gets better, its just frustrating when missing something obvious costs me many hours ... without this forum I suspect I would have given up by now, so I really appreciate all the help!
 

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