Variable Mass:Sand from balloon

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a balloon containing a bag of sand that experiences a constant upthrust while initially at rest and in equilibrium. At time t=0, the sand is released at a constant rate, and the task is to determine the velocity at any time during the release period, expressed in terms of a defined variable.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the momentum equations and the inclusion of all material in the momentum calculations. There are attempts to clarify the relationship between the mass of the system and the forces acting on it. Questions arise regarding the integration process and the treatment of terms in the equations.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, offering suggestions and corrections to each other's reasoning. Some guidance has been provided regarding the integration process and the treatment of variables, but no consensus has been reached on a final approach or solution.

Contextual Notes

There is a focus on ensuring that all components of the system are accounted for in the momentum calculations. The discussion also touches on the definitions and relationships between variables, particularly regarding the rate at which sand is released.

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Homework Statement


A balloon of mass M contains a bag of sand of initial mass ##m_o##. The balloon experiences a constant upthrust and is initially at rest and in equilibrium: the upthrust compensates exactly for the gravitational force. At time t=0, the sand is released at a constant rate. It is fully disposed of in time ##t_o##. Determine the velocity ##v(t)## at any time between t=0 and ##t=t_o##. Express the result in terms of $$k = \frac{m_o}{M+m_o} \frac{1}{t_o}$$

The Attempt at a Solution



At t=0, sand released at constant rate, ##\alpha## say. So, ##\frac{dm}{dt} = -\alpha, ##m the mass of the sand bag. Solve the above to give ##m_s(t) = m_o - \alpha t##

The mass of the whole system (balloon + sand bag), ##M(t) = M + m_o -\alpha t##

By NII, $$P(t+\Delta t) - P(t) = F_{ext} \Delta t \Rightarrow M(t + \Delta t)v(t + \Delta t) - M(t)v(t) = F_{ext}\Delta t$$

Taylor expand the first two terms to give $$(M(t) + \Delta t \dot{M})(v(t) + \Delta t \dot{v}) - M(t)v(t) = [(M + m_o)g - M(t)g]\Delta t,\,\,F_{ext} = (M + m_o)g - M(t)g$$

Collect terms ignore the (very small) ##\Delta t^2## term to get $$\dot{v} - \frac{\alpha}{M + m_o - \alpha t}v = \frac{(M+m_o)g - M(t)g}{M + m_o - \alpha t},$$ which can be solved by integrating factor.

Does it look good so far? When I look at the solution, they end up doing just an ordinary integration.

Many thanks.
 
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##P(t+\Delta t)## should include the momentum of all of the material that is included in ##P(t)##. That would include not only the material still left in the balloon at ##t+\Delta t## but also the sand material that was released during the interval ##\Delta t##.
 
TSny said:
##P(t+\Delta t)## should include the momentum of all of the material that is included in ##P(t)##. That would include not only the material still left in the balloon at ##t+\Delta t## but also the sand material that was released during the interval ##\Delta t##.

##P(t + \Delta t)## is the momentum of the material still left in the balloon after ##\Delta t## and the momentum of the sand released in that ##\Delta t##. So I should have had something like: $$P(t + \Delta t) = M(t+\Delta t)v(t+\Delta t) - dm(v+dv),$$ dv the change in velocity as a result of disposing the sand.

This will reduce the eqn to $$M(t)dv = (M+m_o)g - M(t)g$$ Is it better?
 
CAF123 said:
This will reduce the eqn to $$M(t)dv = (M+m_o)g - M(t)g$$ Is it better?

Yes, that looks good (but you dropped a ##dt## somewhere).
 
CAF123 said:
So I should have had something like: $$P(t + \Delta t) = M(t+\Delta t)v(t+\Delta t) - dm(v+dv),$$ dv the change in velocity as a result of disposing the sand.

Maybe a minor point: For the last term ##dm(v+dv)## you could use just ##v## instead of ##v+dv## since you only need terms to first order.
 
TSny said:
Yes, that looks good (but you dropped a ##dt## somewhere).
So integrating from v(t=0) to v and from t=0 to t gives: $$\int_0^v dv = (M+m_o)g\int_0^t \frac{dt}{M+m_o - \alpha t} - gt$$

This gives $$v(t) = \frac{(M+m_o)g}{\alpha} \ln \left(\frac{M+m_o}{M+m_o-\alpha t}\right) - gt$$

Is there another way to express ##\alpha##?
 
You should be able to express ##\alpha## in terms of ##m_0## and ##t_0##.
 
That would be ##\alpha = m_o/t_o##.
 
CAF123 said:
That would be ##\alpha = m_o/t_o##.
Right.
 

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