Wavefunction of a free particle has carrier and envelope parts

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the wavefunction of a free particle, specifically its decomposition into carrier and envelope components. Participants explore the mathematical representation of the wavefunction, its implications for probability density, and the nature of the complex factors involved.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a wavefunction and describes its carrier wave part characterized by momentum and phase velocity, and an envelope part characterized by momentum width and group velocity.
  • Another participant notes that one of the exponential factors in the wavefunction is complex and serves as a phase factor, which cancels out when calculating probability density.
  • A different participant cautions that the second exponential factor is also complex due to the nature of the parameter gamma, which leads to confusion regarding the envelope and carrier wave distinction.
  • Some participants suggest decomposing the argument of the second exponential into real and imaginary parts to clarify the situation, indicating that both exponentials are complex and contribute to the overall expression.
  • One participant provides a specific form for gamma and suggests substitutions to express the wavefunction in terms of real components, aiming to simplify the understanding of the wavefunction's structure.
  • A visual analogy is proposed, comparing the wavefunction to a bell-shaped curve with sine waves inside, illustrating the relationship between group and phase velocities.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding regarding the decomposition of the wavefunction into carrier and envelope parts. There is no consensus on the clarity of the complex factors involved, and multiple viewpoints on how to approach the problem remain present.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the complexity of the wavefunction's components and the potential confusion arising from the interplay of real and imaginary parts in the exponentials. There are unresolved mathematical steps related to the decomposition of the wavefunction.

Kashmir
Messages
466
Reaction score
74
If

##\psi(x, t)=\left(\frac{1}{2 \pi \alpha^{2}}\right)^{1 / 4} \frac{1}{\sqrt{\gamma}} e^{i p_{0}\left(x-p_{0} t / 2 m\right) / \hbar} e^{-\left(x-p_{0} t / m\right)^{2} / 4 \alpha^{2} \gamma}##where
* ##\gamma=1+\frac{i t}
{\tau}##( a complex number)

* ##\tau=\frac{m h}{2 \beta^{2}}##McIntyre says
" ... this wave packet has a carrier wave part that is characterized by ##p_{0}## and propagates at the phase velocity ##p_{0} / 2 \mathrm{~m}##, and an envelope part that is characterized by the momentum width ##\beta## (through the ##\alpha## parameter) and propagates at the group velocity ##p_{0} / \mathrm{m}##. As we expected, the envelope is a Gaussian function"

I'm not able to understand how the wavefunction has a carrier and an envelope part.

Can anyone help me with this.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
One exponential is complex, so it represents "only" a complex phase factor, dependent on position (and time). When calculating the probability density, i.e., ##| \psi|^2##, it will simply cancel itself out.

The other exponential is real and forms a Gaussian. It is the envelope that defines what ##| \psi|^2## will look like as a function of position.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: hutchphd
Be careful! The 2nd exp-factor is not real since ##\gamma## is complex.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Kashmir and DrClaude
vanhees71 said:
Be careful! The 2nd exp-factor is not real since ##\gamma## is complex.
Exactly.that's why I am not understanding it.
 
Just decompose the argument of the 2nd exp-factor in real and imaginary part. It's just a bit of algebra.
 
vanhees71 said:
Just decompose the argument of the 2nd exp-factor in real and imaginary part. It's just a bit of algebra.
The coefficient is also complex ie ##1/\sqrt{(\gamma)}## is complex ,both the exponentials are complex so we've three factors having real and imaginary parts and upon multiplication they'll give many more real terms. And it's confusing to see the envelope and carrier wave.
 
\gamma=(1+\frac{t^2}{\tau^2})^{1/2}e^{i\eta}
where
\eta=\arctan \frac{t}{\tau}
So
\gamma^{-1/2}=(1+\frac{t^2}{\tau^2})^{-1/4}e^{-i\eta/2}and
\gamma^{-1}=\frac{1}{1+\frac{t^2}{\tau^2}}-i \frac{\frac{t}{\tau}}{1+\frac{t^2}{\tau^2}}
Try these substitutions in your formula to get
\psi = A e^B e^{iC}
where A, B and C are real.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: hutchphd and vanhees71
anuttarasammyak said:
\gamma=(1+\frac{t^2}{\tau^2})^{1/2}e^{i\eta}
where
\eta=\arctan \frac{t}{\tau}
So
\gamma^{-1/2}=(1+\frac{t^2}{\tau^2})^{-1/4}e^{-i\eta/2}and
\gamma^{-1}=\frac{1}{1+\frac{t^2}{\tau^2}}-i \frac{\frac{t}{\tau}}{1+\frac{t^2}{\tau^2}}
Try these substitutions in your formula to get
\psi = A e^B e^{iC}
where A, B and C are real.
Thank you. I'm working on it.
 
Draw a picture of a bell shaped curve. Then draw a lot of sine curves inside.
The bell curve moves with the group velocity and the sine waves inside move at the faster phase velocity,
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71

Similar threads

  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K