What causes the shape of the blackbody radiation graph?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the nature of blackbody radiation and the shape of its spectrum, particularly addressing why the spectrum appears continuous rather than consisting solely of discrete emission lines associated with atomic transitions. Participants explore the relationship between temperature, molecular structure, and thermal radiation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why a heated body, such as hydrogen, would produce a continuous spectrum instead of just discrete emission lines like the Balmer or Lyman series.
  • Another participant argues that thermal radiation is due to vibrating charges within a body, which is temperature-dependent, rather than atomic transitions.
  • A different view suggests that when atoms form molecules, they acquire additional vibrational and rotational degrees of freedom, leading to a continuous spectrum due to interactions between molecules.
  • Some participants note that at higher temperatures, electronic transitions can contribute to the spectrum, and extreme conditions can lead to ionization and X-ray emissions.
  • One participant acknowledges a previous incomplete answer and questions whether the addition of discrete lines would alter the overall shape of the spectrum.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the origins of blackbody radiation and the implications of temperature on the spectrum. There is no consensus on whether the presence of discrete lines affects the overall shape of the spectrum.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various physical concepts such as vibrational and rotational degrees of freedom, statistical-thermodynamical partition functions, and the effects of temperature on energy states, indicating a complex interplay of factors influencing the discussion.

manenbu
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Hello, I got a question about this famous graph of the spectrum given by a heated body, showing the classical line (which goes up) and Planck's line (which gives the hill shape).

How is this line continuous? Let's say my body is a lump of hydrogen, the only points on the graph should be the balmer, lyman, paschen etc wavelength. So I understand that the hotter the body is, the emission is more energetic and has shorter wavelength. But why it shows the entire spectrum and not only the allowed emission lines?
 
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Thermal radiation has nothing to do with atoms or molecules absorbing and emitting light due to electron state transitions. Thermal radiation originates from the vibrating charges in a body, which is why it is dependent on temperature, since temperature corresponds to the strength of the vibrations of the particles in the body.
 
Another name for http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/HBASE/bbcon.html" is "cavity radiation".
 
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manenbu said:
How is this line continuous? Let's say my body is a lump of hydrogen, the only points on the graph should be the balmer, lyman, paschen etc wavelength.

That would be true if your body was some hydrogen atoms, somehow suspended in vacuum. Quite a different thing from what you're actually made of.

The basic answer here is the same reason why you're opaque. The brief answer is that when atoms form molecules, they gain vibrational and rotational degrees of freedom, so you have these levels as well, in-between the electronic excitation levels. Condense the matter and you have additional modes caused by the interactions between molecules. Once you get to a solid, you end up with continuous bands of absorption across most of the visual/IR range, for most substances. (But you don't have the same amount of absorption in every region, hence things have colors)

NanakiXIII said:
Thermal radiation has nothing to do with atoms or molecules absorbing and emitting light due to electron state transitions. Thermal radiation originates from the vibrating charges in a body, which is why it is dependent on temperature, since temperature corresponds to the strength of the vibrations of the particles in the body.

No, temperature corresponds to all energy states (via the statistical-thermodynamical partition function), because these are coupled. It just doesn't correspond to electronic transitions in most substances at room temperature. At higher temperatures you end up with electronic transitions. At high enough temperatures you can even have ionization/X-rays in the blackbody curve (e.g. in the thermal radiation from exploding H-bombs, and from black hole accretion discs)
 
alxm said:
No, temperature corresponds to all energy states (via the statistical-thermodynamical partition function), because these are coupled. It just doesn't correspond to electronic transitions in most substances at room temperature. At higher temperatures you end up with electronic transitions. At high enough temperatures you can even have ionization/X-rays in the blackbody curve (e.g. in the thermal radiation from exploding H-bombs, and from black hole accretion discs)

I had never considered this, but you are right. Apologies to the original poster for giving an incomplete answer. Does the spectrum still have the same shape once you start adding these discrete lines, though?
 

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