What is the Meaning of Life Without Life?

[Intuitive]

Intuitives Belief for the meaning of Life.
The Meaning of Life is: Life Itself, Without Life there would be no meaning.

 

[heartless]

I don't think it works that way. It'd be the same as the definition of the word
'philosophy' is philosophy. Without the word philosophy the definition wouldn't be philosophy. One could ask you then, what is life? and what is it to mean something? The purpose of the derivative is not a derivative, it's to find the slope to a given function, or rate of change at x. Same is with life. I think the reason of life is to experience the wonders of the universe. Experience the notion of hearing, seeing, tasting, smelling, feeling, and thinking, they're amazing. Life itself is amazing and so is the universe itself.

 

[Intuitive]

I don't think it works that way. It'd be the same as the definition of the word
'philosophy' is philosophy. Without the word philosophy the definition wouldn't be philosophy. One could ask you then, what is life? and what is it to mean something? The purpose of the derivative is not a derivative, it's to find the slope to a given function, or rate of change at x. Same is with life. I think the reason of life is to experience the wonders of the universe. Experience the notion of hearing, seeing, tasting, smelling, feeling, and thinking, they're amazing. Life itself is amazing and so is the universe itself.

You could not experience any of that without Life Itself.

Life itself is the Root to its own purpose.

 

[heartless]

You could not experience any of that without Life Itself.

Life itself is the Root to its own purpose.

Universe is the root of life. You couldn't experience any of that without Universe itself. Now look, the purpose of the life is the life. So what? Suppose you're born without senses. Then the purpose of your life is to be but don't interfer with outer you. It's still life. Suppose every human is born tortured to the rest of his/her life. It's still life, but in this case the purpose of your life is to be tortured. Life has a definite purpose, and I believe (notice the world believe) is to experience, not to live itself. Plants also live but their purpose isn't to live but to be the base of the food pyramid. It's purpose is to be the food for all of us. So is with our life, it isn't just the life, but has a definite purpose.

 

[Paul Martin]

I agree with heartless that the purpose of life is to experience the wonders of the universe. I also agree with Erwin Schroedinger that there is only a single entity in the universe that is capable of experiencing. That entity, as heartless has implied, is not only the universe itself, but is the thing in each of us that seems to be able to experience. It is the conscious ability to know. That's all there is to it.

Paul

 

[DaveC426913]

The purpose of life is to come to terms with the fact that there is no purpose to life. You will pass on regardless of whether you do something with your life or piss it away.

Thus, the ONLY reason for doing something rather than nothing is the reasons you create for YOURSELF.

This is not a philosophy of hopelessness, it is a philospohy of self-empowerment and self-responsibility.

 

[Intuitive]

From: heartless
Universe is the root of life. You couldn't experience any of that without Universe itself.

The Universe would have no meaning without Life to find a meaning for it.

Now look, the purpose of the life is the life.

Right O'

So what? Suppose you're born without senses.

Life is full of errors.

Then the purpose of your life is to be but don't interfer with outer you.

Your Life's Purpose extends from your own life.

It's still life.

This is the answer.

Suppose every human is born tortured to the rest of his/her life.

Sometimes Life is a shame.

It's still life, but in this case the purpose of your life is to be tortured.

My Life (Myself) would try to avoid torture, It is a survival tactic of Life to avoid harm to ones self providing one is not mentally derranged in some way.

Life has a definite purpose, and I believe (notice the world believe) is to experience, not to live itself.

You would have no purpose without your Life, Your purpose stems from your existence.

Plants also live but their purpose isn't to live but to be the base of the food pyramid.

A Plant's Life is the Purpose of its Cellular existence.

A Life form would never except being at the bottem of any food chain intentially nor on anyones dinner Plate if the Life form was aware of its possible demise.

It's purpose is to be the food for all of us. So is with our life, it isn't just the life, but has a definite purpose.

No Life form would intentially except being your food if it was aware of its possible demise, It is too your lifes benifit that Plants can't run away.

 

[jimmie]

How about: The meaning of life was to learn that which is right and is to realize and accept the moral.

 

[Tzemach]

Maybe we should be looking at things from another direction. Does life exist to experience the universe or does the universe exist because life experiences it?

 

[Intuitive]

The purpose of life is to come to terms with the fact that there is no purpose to life. You will pass on regardless of whether you do something with your life or piss it away.

Thus, the ONLY reason for doing something rather than nothing is the reasons you create for YOURSELF.

This is not a philosophy of hopelessness, it is a philospohy of self-empowerment and self-responsibility.

What one does with their own Life is their own lifes business unless it clashes with the majority of Life that makes all the rules.

Life is the Root to all Purpose.

 

[heartless]

The Universe would have no meaning without Life to find a meaning for it. (life)

If the universe didn't exist you wouldn't find the meaning of "universe", "life" and any terms. It's like a tree. Root, then log, then branches, then leaves - universe, then life, then people, then the fruit of people's lives or purpose. definition or meaning of the world life would still exist without the life itself but only in mind of God. You wouldn't find the meaning of life without life because you wouldn't have experienced it, or have a notion of it. There are many things that lack definition just because nobody has ever experienced them, or even thought about them, although they still exist in the seeds of time.

Life is full of errors.

Can you point any?

Sometimes Life is a shame. My Life (Myself) would try to avoid torture, It is a survival tactic of Life to avoid harm to ones self providing one is not mentally derranged in some way.

It's not exactly what I mean. If you are born tortured, and you see that everyone is tortured, you're not going to know the words such as "harm" "avoid" "survival" and the like as you have nothing to compare it with. You may do so here, because our world is based upon variety of ideas, beliefs, and experiences but it the world is to be based on one single idea where things such as belief, or freedom or morality is uknown you'll stay tortured to the end of the life not actually knowing that there are choices in other worlds.

You would have no purpose without your Life, Your purpose stems from your existence.

Your life is the base for the purpose. It's just like, elements are the bases for DNA, without elements DNA wouldn't be possible. Elements have a definite purpose, to combine and create, life has a definite purpose, to experience and enjoy.

A Plant's Life is the Purpose of its Cellular existence.

A Life form would never except being at the bottem of any food chain intentially nor on anyones dinner Plate if the Life form was aware of its possible demise.

Plants exist to give you the food. Without plants our mankind wouldn't survive to these days.

No Life form would intentially except being your food if it was aware of its possible demise, It is too your lifes benifit that Plants can't run away.

So you think plants are dead and so are all the animals? Fish is alive, you eat it, and it has nothing to say whether it wants to be eaten or not. Humans are stronger and more intelligent. They need food, and won't care whether a plant or a fish wants to keep on living. Plants were designed to be the food for a human. That's why they don't have feelings, or don't run away. So that it won't suffer nor get you busy running after it.

Intuitive, what is life?

 

[Intuitive]

Heartless.

Purpose would not exist without Life, Life gives Life's Purpose.

The Purpose is only an extension of your being (Life).

 

[heartless]

Heartless.

Purpose would not exist without Life, Life gives Life's Purpose.

The Purpose is only an extension of your being (Life).

Intuitive, what is life?

 

[Intuitive]

Intuitive, what is life?

The first Root to the meaning of Life is Life itself then all purposes extended from your Life give your life it's own branched purpose.

The second Root to the Meaning of Life is the Propagation of the First Root which is still Life Itself.

We weren't talking about what Life is but rather what the meaning to life is.
There are many attribiutes to an organized Living system for the definition of Life, You'd be better off asking a Geneticist.

 

[selfAdjoint]

The first Root to the meaning of Life is Life itself then all purposes extended from your Life give your life it's own branched purpose.

The second Root to the Meaning of Life is the Propagation of the First Root which is still Life Itself.

We weren't talking about what Life is but rather what the meaning to life is.
There are many attribiutes to an organized Living system for the definition of Life, You'd be better off asking a Geneticist.

Science gives you facts, not values. For a scientist who has no other souce of value such as a personal faith, life has no meaning.

 

[Intuitive]

Science gives you facts, not values. For a scientist who has no other souce of value such as a personal faith, life has no meaning.

Heartless said: Intuitive, What is Life?

This is exactly why I refrained from giving a definition to life because the original post was about the meaning of Life rather than it's definition of what Life is.

1.The First Root to the Meaning of Life is Life itself.

2.The Second Meaning to Life is the Propagation of the first Root.

3.The Third Meaning to Life is the assurity of the first Root so as to assure the Propagation of the Second Root and continue to grow into the Tree of Life.

 

[Paul Martin]

The purpose of life is to come to terms with the fact that there is no purpose to life. You will pass on regardless of whether you do something with your life or piss it away.

Thus, the ONLY reason for doing something rather than nothing is the reasons you create for YOURSELF.

This is not a philosophy of hopelessness, it is a philospohy of self-empowerment and self-responsibility.

Dave, have you ever seriously thought about the question of what exactly the self is? It is convenient and common to accept without much thought the notion that the self is nothing more than the chemical biological body. With this notion, the purpose of life that you described makes some kind of sense. But if there is something more, or different, that defines the self, the purpose of life might be something different. Do you think that possibility deserves any consideration?

Maybe we should be looking at things from another direction.

When we are looking at questions that are this mysterious and profound, I think we should look at things from every direction we can think of.

Does life exist to experience the universe or does the universe exist because life experiences it?

Those are both interesting ways to look at the question. Let's look at both of them.

If life exists to experience the universe, then we know that three things exist: life, the universe, and the ability to experience. This raises the question of in what sequence did these things come to exist or did some of them come to exist simultaneously. Combinatorically, there are six ways the three could have appeared separately, twelve ways in which two of them appeared simultaneously, and one way in which all three of them appeared at once. We could logically examine each of the nineteen possibilities and maybe draw some conclusions. I would suggest that we not rule out any of the nineteen without good logical reasons.

In the second case, if the universe exists because life experiences it, then we have posited a causal relationship that requires that life and the ability to experience must exist prior to the existence of the universe. This possibility is included as three of the prior nineteen possibilities.

In my thinking about these possibilities, the one which makes the most sense to me, and which provides a framework for answering all the tough questions, is the combination where life and the ability to experience are identically the same and they (it) came first, thus it is the fundamental essence of reality, or the ontologically fundamental stuff. Then came the universe (i.e. the rest of it, since life/the ability to experience exist and are also part of the universe). In my view, and in my posts, I usually talk about 'the ability to know' which I consider to be identically the same as 'the ability to experience'.

I'd be interested to hear anyone's reasons why any of the other possibilities makes more sense.

Paul

 

[heartless]

Heartless said: Intuitive, What is Life?

This is exactly why I refrained from giving a definition to life because the original post was about the meaning of Life rather than it's definition of what Life is.

1.The First Root to the Meaning of Life is Life itself.

2.The Second Meaning to Life is the Propagation of the first Root.

3.The Third Meaning to Life is the assurity of the first Root so as to assure the Propagation of the Second Root and continue to grow into the Tree of Life.

Intuitive, I didn't ask for origin of the word 'life', I asked what the life is, from your perspective. Suppose I don't know what the life is, and I'd like to know the definition from you. You can't use the word 'life' since I have no idea what it is. I don't think 'propagation' is the right definition of life. Propagation is one of the things you can do during life, and gives life itself still not knowing what the life may really be.

 

[Intuitive]

Intuitive, I didn't ask for origin of the word 'life', I asked what the life is, from your perspective.

My definition of the word Life, aside from the dictionary definition.

Anything that has self purpose both directly and indirectly is my definition for a living thing, But I refrain from going further with this because the purposes are endless.

Only living things conceive defined puposes, This includes the Cellular Level as well as the Macro Level.

Suppose I don't know what the life is, and I'd like to know the definition from you.

See above.

You can't use the word 'life' since I have no idea what it is.

See above.

I don't think 'propagation' is the right definition of life. Propagation is one of the things you can do during life, and gives life itself still not knowing what the life may really be.

The first Root is the Base of the Root system, The Beginning of Life or the Meaning, From that Root comes the second Root and from all the Roots forms the Foundation to the Tree of Life, The Trunk and Upper Branches are all of Lifes Purposes that extend from its Foundation or it's Roots, But the Beginning of the Root is Life itself, The upper Branches are the Purposes that can either be a bad Tree with no Flowers or Fruit or can be a flowering and fruiting Tree of good, Without Propagation Life would wither away.

The Ultimate Root of Life is immortality or the assurance of Life.

 

[heartless]

My definition of the word Life, aside from the dictionary definition.

Anything that has self purpose both directly and indirectly is my definition for a living thing, But I refrain from going further with this because the purposes are endless.

Only living things conceive defined puposes, This includes the Cellular Level as well as the Macro Level.

Atmosphere has a self-purpose, although it isn't alive. Why non-living things lack defined purposes? So what's a defined purpose of a bacteria? of a rat? of a yeast?
The purpose of life is life itself, then why don't you commit a suicide and get rid of the life which is "full of errors."? (don't mean to offend, I'd like to hear the answer.)

 

[quantumdude]

Guys and/or Gals,

The opening post of this thread doesn't even come close to complying with the Philosophy Forums Guidelines, and the thread hasn't gotten any closer to compliance as it has developed. This is a chat session. There's nothing wrong with that, but that's not what the Philosophy section of PF is for.

Since the Philosophy Mentors seem to be busy, I am going to move this to General Discussion.

 

[Evo]

AARRGHGH!

How dare you stick a "meaning of life" thread in my forum??

We *do* have some standards here.

 

[Chi Meson]

The purpose of life is to come to terms with the fact that there is no purpose to life. You will pass on regardless of whether you do something with your life or piss it away.

Thus, the ONLY reason for doing something rather than nothing is the reasons you create for YOURSELF.

This is not a philosophy of hopelessness, it is a philospohy of self-empowerment and self-responsibility.

I was about to say the same thing.

Join us! Become a happy nihilist!

 

[Curious3141]

Life has meaning. It exists to prolong itself long enough to ensure that the genetic material associated with that vital packet is passed on to a new generation. It is the security detail protecting a set of genes, no more, no less.

That's all there is to it. We exist to sire children. All the rest is irrelevant commentary, pontification and aggrandizement.

 

[selfAdjoint]

Life has meaning. It exists to prolong itself long enough to ensure that the genetic material associated with that vital packet is passed on to a new generation. It is the security detail protecting a set of genes, no more, no less.

That's all there is to it. We exist to sire children. All the rest is irrelevant commentary, pontification and aggrandizement.

So the people who elect not to have children, like Erdos, or who are prevented from it by physical disabilities like Hawking, lead meaningless lives?

 

[Chi Meson]

Life has meaning. It exists to prolong itself long enough to ensure that the genetic material associated with that vital packet is passed on to a new generation. It is the security detail protecting a set of genes, no more, no less.

That's all there is to it. We exist to sire children. All the rest is irrelevant commentary, pontification and aggrandizement.

That would be "Unhappy Nihilism." There's no need for arrogance.

 

[Chi Meson]

So the people who elect not to have children, like Erdos, or who are prevented from it by physical disabilities like Hawking, lead meaningless lives?

Steven Hawking has two sons and a Daughter.

 

[Curious3141]

So the people who elect not to have children, like Erdos, or who are prevented from it by physical disabilities like Hawking, lead meaningless lives?

I believe the intrinsic, fundamental meaning of their lives is void, yes. I'm sorry if that's harsh, but biology is not always comforting.

Of course, people will think up ways to give new "meaning" to their lives when the basic biological purpose is not fulfilled, but IMHO, these are desperate rationalisations.

You only have to look at the utter hopelessness childless couples feel to appreciate the importance procreation actually has in our lives.

 

[Curious3141]

That would be "Unhappy Nihilism." There's no need for arrogance.

Where was I arrogant ? I'm speaking my mind here. I feel that while I may want many things in my own life (I do), the basic purpose of it is simply to pass on my genes to healthy offspring.

 

[Chi Meson]

Where was I arrogant ? I'm speaking my mind here. I feel that while I may want many things in my own life (I do), the basic purpose of it is simply to pass on my genes to healthy offspring.

We are all speaking our minds and stating our opinions. When we singularly announce our personal opinion as correct and denounce "All the rest is irrelevant commentary, pontification and aggrandizement," that is arrogant.