What is the relationship between integrals and measures in measure theory?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on the relationship between integrals and measures in measure theory, exploring how integrals can be viewed as measures and the conditions under which this holds. Participants examine various types of integrals, including the Lebesgue and Riemann integrals, and their properties in relation to measures.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that an integral can be viewed as a measure, defining it as a mapping from a family of sets to the reals, and proposes that the integral of a function over a set is the measure of the image of that function.
  • Another participant disagrees with this characterization, implying that the initial description is incorrect and suggesting the need for further study before reformulating the ideas.
  • A later reply clarifies that a measure is a set function that must satisfy certain invariants, and proposes that integrals can be seen as special cases of measures, with the Lebesgue integral addressing shortcomings of the Riemann integral.
  • Another participant agrees with the clarification and notes that while the integral of a measurable function is not generally a measure, certain functions can yield integrals that are measures, providing examples to illustrate this point.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between integrals and measures, with some supporting the idea that integrals can be viewed as measures under certain conditions, while others challenge this perspective. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing views present.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention specific properties and conditions related to measures and integrals, such as countable additivity and the treatment of null sets, but do not reach a consensus on the broader implications of these relationships.

cappadonza
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I just beginning to study measure theory. so far from what i understand so far , can we say in general, an integral is a measure, (ie it is nothing but a set function. a mapping F : \mathcal{F} \rightarrow \mathbb{R} where \mathcal{F} is a family of sets.

does it make sense to say in general an integral of a function F, is \int_{A} F d\mu is the measure of the image of the F over some set A using the measure \mu. with the condition the image of F over A must be measurable using the measure \mu

so for example the two that i know are lebesgue-integral, lebesgue-stieltjes integral, are basically are general integrals using different measures.

if we could say the above then where would the riemann integral fit into this.
sorry if this is a bit vague, I'm trying to get my head around this stuff
 
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No, I would say your description is wrong. Why not wait a couple more weeks in the course, then try to fomulate it again?
 
I'm not actually doing a course, i work full-time, its something I'm trying to learn through self-study. i go back re-learn what i thought i knew and re-formulate it in the next week or so
thanks
 
okay here is my second attempt:
A measure is a set function \mathcal{F} \to \Re. where \mathcal{F} is a sigma-algebra. the invariants it must satisfy are it countable additive and the measure of a null-set is zero.
Now integral \int_{B} f d\mu is nothing but a special case of a measure, where it calculates the measure of the set described by f over the set B. The arbitrary measure \mu is use to calculate the measure of this set.
Since we viewing integral is as measure it must satisfy the invariants of a measure such as being countable additive. The Riemann-integral only satisfies this condition only a small class of functions, this why the Lebesgue integral is introduced, to over come some of these shor-coming
 
I'd say you're on the right track.

Even though the integral of a real-valued (measurable) function over a subset D of the domain on which the function is defined is not in general a measure, it is certainy possible (and easy) to define functions whose integral will be a measure.

E.g. a strictly positive real-valued function will have an integral that is a measure, but the intgral of a sine-wave will not fulfill the axioms of a measure.

You can, in fact, view any real-valued positive function as a quotient between two different measures on the same sigma-algebra: see the "Radon–Nikodym theorem", it was of great help for me understanding measures in relation to measurable functions.
 

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