When will steam turbines be replaced to directly generate electricity?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the future of steam turbines in electricity generation, exploring whether they will be replaced by newer technologies or continue to be utilized. Participants examine the efficiency, technological advancements, and alternatives to steam turbines, including the potential of magnetohydrodynamics (MHD) and other energy sources.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants argue that steam turbine technology is outdated, likening it to 1800s technology, while others counter that modern steam turbines are significantly advanced and efficient.
  • One participant highlights the impressive technology in large turbine-generator sets and the efficiency gained from exploiting the heat of vaporization through multiple stages.
  • There is a discussion about the extent to which steam turbines might be replaced, with some suggesting that complete replacement is unlikely in the foreseeable future, while others note that alternatives like water turbines, wind, solar, and nuclear power are increasingly contributing to electricity generation.
  • A participant raises the question of using magnetohydrodynamics (MHD) with plasmas as a practical method for extracting electricity from heat.
  • Modern steam turbines are noted to operate at thermodynamic efficiencies of 80-90%, with adaptability to varying heat energy levels, although they are less suitable for small-scale energy production due to their size and operating temperature requirements.
  • There is a comparison made between the evolution of steam turbines and other fundamental technologies, suggesting that while the basic principles may remain, the materials and manufacturing processes have significantly improved over time.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the future of steam turbines, with no consensus reached on whether they will be replaced or continue to coexist with newer technologies. Some believe in the enduring relevance of steam turbines, while others advocate for the potential of alternative energy sources.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the efficiency and adaptability of steam turbines, as well as the potential of emerging technologies like MHD, which remain unresolved. The comparison to historical technologies raises questions about the evolution of energy generation methods.

zheng89120
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this is like 1800s technology for most parts
 
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zheng89120 said:
this is like 1800s technology for most parts
Not really. Have you ever been in the control room of a large T-G generator set? The technology is pretty impressive.

Plus, exploiting the heat of vaporization through multiple stages (from feed-end to vacuum at the condenser end) let's you extract a lot of work out of that steam before returning the condensate to the feedwater cycle of the steam-generator (usually boilers of some description in industrial settings). I don't see steam going away any time soon. If you want more primitive technology, look no further than hydro-electric dams. They will still be around for a long time, barring smaller, less-efficient dams. Locally, some low-head dams are being slated for breaching and removal so that valuable fish-runs can be restored.
 
What, exactly do you mean by "be replaced"? If you mean "none used whatsoever", that probably will not happen, at least for the foreseeable future. If you mean replaced to some or a large extent, that has already happened and has been happening for some time. Much of the electricty in The United States, and, I am sure in the rest of the world, is produced by water turbines. A small amount, increasing all the time, is produced by wind turbines, solar panels, and nuclear power plants.

(Even with the problems at Chernyoble and now in Japan, far more people have been killed mining coal for power plants than in nuclear accidents.)
 
I meant steam turbines generating electricity from heat sources
what about MHD in the use of plasmas to extract electricity from heat, practical?
 
Modern steam turbines are quite different from the piston steam engines of James Watt. In modern power stations I believe they work with a thermodynamic efficiency of 80-90%. They do this whilst being relatively easy to maintain and being adaptable to varying amounts of heat energy being available. For small scale energy production you're probably correct since turbines are not very portable and require very high operating temperatures of over 500 deg C.
 
There are some basics to technology that will never go away completely. For example, the wheel was invented thousands of years ago as was the lever. Do we still use them? Of course we do! Why? Because they work! Would you say the automobile tires of today are exactly the same as a wagon wheel 1 thousand years ago? No! The materials and quality of manufacturing have improved enormously since then. A similar thing happened to the turbine.
 

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