Why Did Radon Choose Riemann-Stieltjes Over Lebesgue Integration?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter jsr9119
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the choice of integration methods in the context of the Radon transform, specifically comparing the Riemann-Stieltjes integral and the Lebesgue integral. Participants explore the implications of using these different integrals in higher order transforms and the generality of Lebesgue integration.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Jeff questions why Radon chose the Riemann-Stieltjes integral over the Lebesgue integral, noting that many sources cite the latter as necessary for handling measures in higher order transforms.
  • Some participants assert that the Lebesgue integral is more general than the Riemann integral and suggest that Radon's paper could have used Lebesgue integration instead, though they acknowledge potential technical differences.
  • There is a discussion about the distinction between "Lebesgue Integration" and "integration with respect to Lebesgue measure," with some participants noting that Lebesgue measure is a specific measure that represents length, while Lebesgue integration can be defined with respect to any measure.
  • Participants explore whether Riemann-Stieltjes integration can be included as a special case of Lebesgue integration and discuss the necessity of using measures other than Lebesgue measure for this inclusion.
  • One participant explains that the Lebesgue-Stieltjes integral is essentially Lebesgue integration with respect to a given measure.
  • There is a mention of summation as a special case of Lebesgue integration, using counting or Dirac measures.
  • Some participants express that the terminology around Lebesgue integration can be ambiguous, as it may refer to general integration with respect to any measure or specifically to Lebesgue measure, depending on the context.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the implications of using Riemann-Stieltjes versus Lebesgue integration, and multiple competing views remain regarding the definitions and applications of these integrals.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved questions regarding the specific conditions under which Riemann-Stieltjes integration can be considered a special case of Lebesgue integration, as well as the implications of using different measures in this context.

jsr9119
Messages
14
Reaction score
0
Hey guys,

I'm doing a paper on the Radon transform and several sources I've come across cite the Lebesgue integral as a necessary tool to handle measures in higher order transforms.
But, Radon's original paper employs the Riemann-Stieltjes integral in its place.

I read that Lebesgue is more general and so Radon could have used it in place of RSI. Is this the case?

Thanks,

Jeff
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The Lebesgue integral is indeed more general than the Riemann integral.
Using measure theory, we can also develop the Lebesgue-Stieltjes integral, and this is a generalization of the Riemann-Stieltjes integral.

So yes, the paper could probably be written with Lebesgue instead of Riemann. But there may be technical differences between the two.
 
Is there a distinction between "Lebesgue Integration" and "integration with respect to Lebesgue measure"? My impressions is that "Lebesgue measure" on the real number line is a particular measure that implements the usual notion of length, so the measure of a single point would be zero. On the other hand, is "Lebesgue integration" defined with respect to an arbitrary measure?

For Lebesgue Integration to include Riemann-Stieljes integration as a special case, is it necessary to use measures other than Legesgue measure? (I'm thinking of the specific example of defining an integration that can integrate a discrete probability density function by the method of assigning non-zero measure to certain isolated points and turning "integration" into summation.)
 
Lebesgue-Stieljes integral is best described as Lebesgue integration with respect to a given measure.
 
Stephen Tashi said:
Is there a distinction between "Lebesgue Integration" and "integration with respect to Lebesgue measure"? My impressions is that "Lebesgue measure" on the real number line is a particular measure that implements the usual notion of length, so the measure of a single point would be zero. On the other hand, is "Lebesgue integration" defined with respect to an arbitrary measure?

Yes. Lebesgue integration is defined with respect to a measure. The procedure is the same, but different measures give different integrals.

For Lebesgue Integration to include Riemann-Stieljes integration as a special case, is it necessary to use measures other than Legesgue measure?

The Lebesgue measure is derived from the set function ##m((a,b])=b-a##.
The Stieljes measure is derived from the set function ##m(a,b]) = g(b)-g(a)## for some monotonically increasing function g.

(I'm thinking of the specific example of defining an integration that can integrate a discrete probability density function by the method of assigning non-zero measure to certain isolated points and turning "integration" into summation.)

Summation is a special case of Lebesgue integration, using the counting measure over Z, or Dirac measure over R.
 
In my experience, it's a bit ambiguous. When talking about Lebesgue integration, sometimes people talk about general integration wrt a measure and sometimes they talk about integration wrt Lebesgue measure. It's usually clear from the context though.
 

Similar threads

  • Poll Poll
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
17K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
3K
Replies
8
Views
5K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
5K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
5K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
7K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K