History Why didn't ancient civilizations harness the power of electricity?

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The discussion centers on the historical understanding and potential use of electricity and magnetism by ancient civilizations, particularly the Greeks and Egyptians. Participants explore why it took so long for the principles of electromagnetism to be harnessed, despite early knowledge of magnets and static electricity. The conversation highlights that while ancient cultures may have had rudimentary concepts of electricity, they lacked the necessary technology, materials, and mathematical understanding to develop practical applications. Key points include the challenges of producing quality conductors, the absence of a stable current source, and the societal focus on survival rather than scientific exploration. The role of innovation is debated, with some arguing that a culture of systematic knowledge dissemination, which emerged later, was crucial for technological advancement. Overall, the thread reflects on the complexities of historical technological development and the gradual evolution of scientific thought leading to modern electrical applications.
  • #31
Vanadium 50 said:
Or why it took as long as it did for cavalry to catch on?
The stirrup was a prerequisite for effective cavalry, I believe.
 
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  • #32
That would certainly explain it.
 
  • #33
U.S. Energy Information Administration

Electricity is a secondary energy source


Electricity is the flow of electrical power or charge. Electricity is both a basic part of nature and one of the most widely used forms of energy.

The electricity that we use is a secondary energy source because it is produced by converting primary sources of energy such as coal, natural gas, nuclear energy, solar energy, and wind energy, into electrical power. Electricity is also referred to as an energy carrier, which means it can be converted to other forms of energy such as mechanical energy or heat. Primary energy sources are renewable or nonrenewable energy, but the electricity we use is neither renewable nor nonrenewable.Electricity use has dramatically changed daily life

Despite its great importance in daily life, few people probably stop to think about what life would be like without electricity. Like air and water, people tend to take electricity for granted. However, people use electricity to do many jobs every day—from lighting, heating, and cooling homes to powering televisions and computers.

Before electricity became widely available, about 100 years ago, candles, whale oil lamps, and kerosene lamps provided light; iceboxes kept food cold; and wood-burning or coal-burning stoves provided heat.

Scientists and inventors have worked to decipher the principles of electricity since the 1600s. Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Edison, and Nikola Tesla made notable contributions to our understanding and use of electricity.

Benjamin Franklin demonstrated that lightning is electricity. Thomas Edison invented the first long-lasting incandescent light bulb.

Before 1879, direct current (DC) electricity was used in arc lights for outdoor lighting. In the late 1800s, Nikola Tesla pioneered the generation, transmission, and use of alternating current (AC) electricity, which reduced the cost of transmitting electricity over long distances. Tesla's inventions brought electricity into homes to power indoor lighting and into factories to power industrial machines.

Last updated: March 20, 2020

https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/electricity/
 
  • #34
Antiquity did not have a culture of innovation.Maybe the thing to explain is rather how did they even manage to innovate given this lack.
I think the first person to have a positive theory or ideology of innovation was Francis Bacon.
In his time things were just beginning to move, as he must have noticed.
Once an innovation has somehow happened it will often be irresistible.
E.g. in military matters as said above, if you don't innovate to match your enemy's innovation, he conquers you, so it spreads one way or the other. It then if you have won and have become good at that technique of winning, you don't particularly want the technique to change again.
On the other hand innovation can often threaten social systems and interests, and for that reason was often opposed.
 
  • #35
epenguin said:
Antiquity did not have a culture of innovation ... I think the first person to have a positive theory or ideology of innovation was Francis Bacon.
What? Either you have a very strange view what innovation is, or this is so wrong, that it isn't even wrong. The easiest counter example is always supplied by warfare. There has been plenty of innovation between the first hand axe and a halberd.
 
  • #36
fresh_42 said:
What? Either you have a very strange view what innovation is, or this is so wrong, that it isn't even wrong. The easiest counter example is always supplied by warfare. There has been plenty of innovation between the first hand axe and a halberd.

I agree with epenguin, at least in general. There is a pretty clear difference between pre-baconian times and post. The development of empiricism and the scientific method greatly accelerated innovation and improvement in all areas. Bacon himself wasn't solely responsible for this, as it is clear that the 'roots' of this innovation-driven culture had been forming for quite some time, but the tree didn't sprout until Bacon's time and in no small part due to his influence.
 
  • #37
Drakkith said:
I agree with epenguin, at least in general. There is a pretty clear difference between pre-baconian times and post. The development of empiricism and the scientific method greatly accelerated innovation and improvement in all areas. Bacon himself wasn't solely responsible for this, as it is clear that the 'roots' of this innovation-driven culture had been forming for quite some time, but the tree didn't sprout until Bacon's time and in no small part due to his influence.
You cannot say that people weren't innovative before the 16th century. Sorry, but either innovative means something completely different in English than the same word means in German, or this is ridiculous. Every single culture had to be innovative to survive, and later to develop. The history of mankind is marked by innovations. You basically say that the pyramids could have been built without innovations. We still don't know how they made it! And the zero was a great Indian innovation: they named something which wasn't there! This was several thousand years before Bacon. Innovation is the basic property which enabled us to colonize the planet.
 
  • #38
fresh_42 said:
You cannot say that people weren't innovative before the 16th century.

I am not saying so. Of course there were innovative people. I'm talking about a culture. One with a focused, systematic way to develop and disseminate knowledge, improvements, technology, etc, and one readily accepting of such changes that they introduce.

It's the difference between improvements in a craft being slowly passed through word of mouth and generational teaching, versus improvements being rapidly spread through widespread discussion, journals, mass-teaching, etc.

The word 'culture' is the key word here in 'culture of innovation', not innovation.
 
  • #39
Every invention requires a innovative person. Hence innovations are closely connected to mankind.
Drakkith said:
I'm talking about a culture.
Sorry, but I totally disagree with this point of view. It was before the 16th century, during the 16th century and after the 16th century until today when what you call a culture was, has been, and is limited to a small group of people who have the luxury not to fight for food on a daily basis. This was true for Archimedes, as it was for Bacon, and is today. The limits you draw to separate a group of persons from the general population, and inventions from innovations are all artificial and deliberately set. I cannot see by any means a turning point in the 16th century. At best it has been the fact that more people than before possessed the luxury to invent. But even this quantitative distinction is wrong, as this group of people grew since we settled down. If anything, then it was the age of enlightenment beginning with the 18th century which set a turning point in the sense that religion, and superstition were replaced by reason.
 
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  • #40
@fresh_42 Then I guess we'll agree to disagree.
 
  • #41
They did. Look up the Baghdad batteries.
 
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  • #42
Flatland said:
They did. Look up the Baghdad batteries.
Yes certainly they knew a thing or two about electricity, however they didn't manage to get into the very advanced technological miracles like computers and smartphones. Electricity came into heavy use in the world since 1900s and within 120 years our life is affected by electricity so much, that we can't imagine how human societies existed for the prior 5000 years without electricity, computers and smartphones.
 

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