Why is Radical i Squared Not Equal to -1?

  • Context: High School 
  • Thread starter Thread starter grad
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Radical
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the mathematical reasoning behind the expression involving the square root of the imaginary unit \(i\) and why the equality \(\sqrt{i^2} = -1\) is not valid. Participants explore the implications of using non-real numbers in exponentiation and square roots, touching on concepts from complex numbers and principal values.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the equality \(a^m a^n = a^{m+n}\) does not hold for non-real numbers, particularly in the context of \(i\).
  • One participant points out that \(\sqrt{i^4} = \pm i^2\) indicates the presence of multiple roots.
  • Another participant emphasizes that the expression \(\sqrt{a \cdot b} = \sqrt{a} \cdot \sqrt{b}\) is not valid for non-real numbers.
  • There is a claim that the error in reasoning arises from equating different solutions without considering principal values, leading to contradictions such as \(1 = -1\).
  • One participant illustrates the use of De Moivre's Theorem to show that \(1\) can be represented in multiple ways, which complicates the square root operation.
  • Another participant discusses a similar example involving fractions that leads to the erroneous conclusion that \(-1 = 1\), highlighting the pitfalls of misapplying square root properties.
  • Several participants agree that errors arise when evaluating expressions incorrectly, particularly when dealing with square roots of negative numbers.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the validity of certain mathematical operations involving non-real numbers. There is no consensus on the correct interpretation of the square root of complex numbers, and multiple competing views are presented throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Limitations in the discussion include the dependence on definitions of principal values and the unresolved nature of certain mathematical steps, particularly in the manipulation of square roots and powers involving complex numbers.

grad
Messages
12
Reaction score
0
I am sure that it's a stupid question that has already been answered in the past, but I couldn't find the solution anywhere. Well I want to know why the following attached equality is not true:
 

Attachments

  • image001.png
    image001.png
    873 bytes · Views: 489
Mathematics news on Phys.org
This has been said over and over again. aman= am+n is NOT true for non-real numbers. In particular, a1= a1/2a1/2 is not true for non-real numbers.
 
because

[tex]\sqrt{i^4}=\pm i^2[/tex]


you have two roots.
 
grad said:
[tex]1=\sqrt{i^4}=\sqrt{i^2i^2}=\sqrt{i^2}\sqrt{i^2}=i*i=-1[/tex]
What you wrote is invalid:

HallsofIvy said:
This has been said over and over again. aman= am+n is NOT true for non-real numbers.
It's not even true for all real numbers. If m and n are real numbers, aman=am+n is only true for positive real numbers a and only when am is interpreted to mean the principal value.[/quote]
I was assuming, as is standard, that the real valued ai is only defined for a> 0 and that it meant the principal value.

Trouble arises as soon as one starts allowing solutions other than principal values (e.g., -1 as a solution to [itex]x^2-1=0[/itex]). For example, the same invalid mathematics as used in the original post can be used to show -1=1 without resorting to imaginary numbers:

[tex]1=\sqrt{(-1)^2}=\sqrt{(-1)^21^2}=\sqrt{(-1)^2}\sqrt{1^2}=(-1)*1=-1[/tex]

The error here arises from writing [itex]\sqrt{(-1)^2}=-1[/itex].
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I hope this helps...

"1" can be written as 1*cis(0 + 360n)

where:
- cis(x) = cos(x) + i*sin(x)
- I am working in degrees...
- n is any integer

one can see that there may be an infinite no. ways of writing i depending on what n is...

Now square rooting; the De Moivre's Theorem is used...

SQRT(1) = cis(360n / 2) = cis(180n)

you see, this gives +/- 1 (since the argument can be 0 or 180)...

You in fact have taken 2 different solutions and equated them... Which is what the replies have said already...
 
Here is a similar "puzzle":

[tex]\frac{-1}{1}=\frac{1}{-1}[/tex]

[tex]\sqrt{\frac{-1}{1}}=\sqrt{\frac{1}{-1}}[/tex]

[tex]\frac{\sqrt{-1}}{\sqrt{1}}=\frac{\sqrt{1}}{\sqrt{-1}}[/tex]

[tex]\frac{i}{\sqrt{1}}=\frac{\sqrt{1}}{i}[/tex]

[tex]i^2 = \left(\sqrt{1}\right)^2[/tex]

[tex]i^2=1[/tex]

[tex]-1 = 1[/tex]
 
grad said:
[tex]1=\sqrt{i^4}=\sqrt{i^2i^2}=\sqrt{i^2}\sqrt{i^2}=i*i=-1[/tex]

In this problem posted by grad the error is due to the fact that:

[tex]\sqrt{i^2i^2}\ne\sqrt{i^2}\sqrt{i^2}[/tex]

The correct way to evaluate the problem is:

[tex]1=\sqrt{i^4}=\sqrt{i^2i^2}=\sqrt{(-1)(-1)} = \sqrt{1}= 1[/tex]

In the problem I posted in my last post the error is this step:

[tex]\sqrt{\frac{-1}{1}}=\sqrt{\frac{1}{-1}}[/tex] ==> [tex]\frac{\sqrt{-1}}{\sqrt{1}}=\frac{\sqrt{1}}{\sqrt{-1}}[/tex]

because:

[tex]\sqrt{\frac{1}{-1}} \ne \frac{\sqrt{1}}{\sqrt{-1}}[/tex]

The correct way to evaluate that problem is

[tex]\sqrt{\frac{-1}{1}}=\sqrt{\frac{1}{-1}}[/tex] ==> [tex]\sqrt{-1}=\sqrt{-1}[/tex]==> [tex]i = i[/tex]

D H said:
...
Trouble arises as soon as one starts allowing solutions other than principal values (e.g., -1 as a solution to [itex]x^2-1=0[/itex]). For example, the same invalid mathematics as used in the original post can be used to show -1=1 without resorting to imaginary numbers:

[tex]1=\sqrt{(-1)^2}=\sqrt{(-1)^21^2}=\sqrt{(-1)^2}\sqrt{1^2}=(-1)*1=-1[/tex]

The error here arises from writing [itex]\sqrt{(-1)^2}=-1[/itex].

D H has correctly identified the error in the example he posted above.
The correct way to evaluate his example is:

[tex]1=\sqrt{(-1)^2}=\sqrt{1}= 1[/tex]

The pattern that emerges from all these examples is that the errors arise when bracketed terms are evalauted from the outside first and then working inwards. All the errors can be avoided by evaluating the expressions in the inner brackets first and working outwards.

Generally speaking [tex](a^ba^c)^d[/tex] is not guaranteed to be the same as [tex]a^{bd}a^{cd}[/tex] or even [tex]a^{d(b+c)}[/tex] and it is less risky to evaluate [tex](a^b*a^c)^d[/tex] as [tex](a^{(b+c)})^d }[/tex]
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
5K
  • · Replies 19 ·
Replies
19
Views
4K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
3K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
4K