(x) and (x,y) are prime ideals of Q[x,y]

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the properties of the ideals $(x)$ and $(x,y)$ in the polynomial ring $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]$, specifically examining their status as prime and maximal ideals. Participants explore the structure of the quotient rings $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]/(x)$ and $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]/(x,y)$ to establish these properties.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that to show $(x)$ and $(x,y)$ are prime ideals, it is necessary to demonstrate that the corresponding quotient rings are integral domains.
  • Another participant proposes that $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]/(x) \cong \mathbb{Q}[y]$ and $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]/(x,y) \cong \mathbb{Q}$, indicating that finding surjective ring homomorphisms could help establish this.
  • A later reply provides a specific mapping $h:\mathbb{Q}[x,y]\rightarrow \mathbb{Q}[y]$ and discusses its properties, questioning whether it is a homomorphism and how to determine its kernel.
  • Further elaboration includes an isomorphism between $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]$ and $(\mathbb{Q}[y])[x]$, suggesting that understanding this relationship could aid in proving the properties of the ideals.
  • One participant expresses interest in a related problem regarding the ideal $(2,x,y)$ in $\mathbb{Z}[x,y]$, questioning its isomorphism.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the approach to demonstrate the properties of the ideals, but there is no consensus on the specific steps or methods to be used, as various participants propose different mappings and techniques.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the properties of polynomial rings and the nature of surjective homomorphisms are present, but these are not fully resolved within the discussion.

mathmari
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Hey! :o

I want to show that the ideals $(x)$ and $(x,y)$ are prime ideals of $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]$ but only the second one is a maximal ideal.

We have to show that $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]/(x)$ and $\mathbb{Q}[x,y]/(x,y)$ are integral domains, right? (Wondering)

How could we show it? Could you give me a hint? (Wondering)
 
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Modding by a finitely-generated ideal has the effect of essentially setting the generators equal to 0.

See if you can prove that $\Bbb Q[x,y]/(x) \cong \Bbb Q[y]$, and $\Bbb Q[x,y]/(x,y) \cong \Bbb Q$, by finding surjective ring homomorphisms for which these ideals are kernels.
 
Deveno said:
Modding by a finitely-generated ideal has the effect of essentially setting the generators equal to 0.

See if you can prove that $\Bbb Q[x,y]/(x) \cong \Bbb Q[y]$, and $\Bbb Q[x,y]/(x,y) \cong \Bbb Q$, by finding surjective ring homomorphisms for which these ideals are kernels.

To show that $\Bbb Q[x,y]/(x) \cong \Bbb Q[y]$ do we use the following mapping? (Wondering)
$$h:\mathbb{Q}[x,y]\rightarrow \mathbb{Q}[y] \\ f(x,y)\mapsto f(0,y)$$

Then does it hold that $h(f_1(x,y)\cdot f_2(x,y))=f_1(0,y)\cdot f_2(0,y)$ and $h(f_1(x,y))\cdot h(f_2(x,y))=f_1(0,y)\cdot f_2(0,y)$ ? (Wondering)

If this is true, then we have that $h$ is an homomorphism.

So, we have to show that the kernel is $(x)$, right? But how could we do that? (Wondering)
 
It's perhaps easiest to first note that $\Bbb Q[x,y] \cong (\Bbb Q[y])[x]$. I leave you to puzzle out what this isomorphism has to be. We will use this isomorphism to equate the two rings (we can call this "collecting like terms of $x^k$"). For example, if:

$f(x,y) = a_0 + a_1x + a_2y + a_3x^2 + a_4xy + a_5y^2 + a_6x^3 + a_7x^2y + a_8xy^2 + a_9y^3$, then we have:

$f(x,y) = f_0(y) + f_1(y)x + f_2(y)x^2 + f_3(y)x^3$, where:

$f_0(y) = a_0 + a_2y + a_5y^2 + a_9y^3$
$f_1(y) = a_1 + a_4y + a_8y^2$
$f_2(y) = a_3 + a_7y$
$f_3(y) = a_6$.

Now for any commutative ring $R$ we have for any extension ring $S$ of $R$, and any $a \in S$, a unique homomorphism:

$\phi_a: R[x] \to S$, given by $\phi_a(f(x)) = f(a)$, the so-called "evaluation at $a$ homomorphism". This is, in fact, one of the *defining properties* of a polynomial ring.

Now take $R = \Bbb Q[y]$, and we see that:

$f(x,y) \mapsto f(0,y)$ is just the evaluation homomorphism $\phi_0$. You can also show this is a homomorphism directly, it's not hard (but tedious).

Now if $g \in (x)$, we have $g(x,y) = xr(x,y)$, for some $r \in \Bbb Q[x,y]$.

So, $\phi_0(g) = \phi_0(xr) = 0r(0,y) = 0$, which shows $(x) \subseteq \text{ker }\phi_0$.

On the other hand, suppose $\phi_0(f(x,y)) = 0$.

Since $f(x,y) = f_0(y) + f_1(y)x + \cdots + f_n(y)x^n$

we have $\phi_0(f(x,y)) = f_0(y) + f_1(y)\cdot 0 + \cdots + f_n(y)\cdot 0^n = f_0(y)$.

Since this is $0 \in \Bbb Q[y]$, we have $f_0(y) = 0$, and thus:

$f(x,y) = x(f_1(y) + f_2(y)x + \cdots + f_n(y)x^{n-1}) \in (x)$, so $\text{ker }\phi_0 \subseteq (x)$.

Now do this process TWICE to get two surjective homomorphisms:

$\Bbb Q[x,y] \to \Bbb Q[y] \to \Bbb Q$, whose composition is thus *also* a surjective homomorphism (let's call it $\pi$).

It is easy to show that $(x,y) \subseteq \text{ker }\pi$. A similar argument as above may help you with the other inclusion.
 
Last edited:
I understand! Thank you very much! (Yes)

I want to show also that the ideal $(2,x,y)$ is a prime ideal of $\mathbb{Z}[x,y]$.

What is $\mathbb{Z}[x,y]/(2,x,y)$ isomorphic to? (Wondering)
 

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