XMM observes evidence of dark energy

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the implications of the XMM-Newton observatory's discovery of a massive galaxy cluster and its potential connection to dark energy and dark matter. Participants explore the validity of claims regarding dark energy's existence and its relation to current models in physics, including the standard model and cosmological theories.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant claims that the discovery of the galaxy cluster confirms the existence of dark energy, while another strongly disputes this, suggesting that dark energy and dark matter are myths and that gravity is not fully understood.
  • A participant challenges others to explain how dark matter and dark energy fit into the standard model, questioning whether reconsidering the cosmological constant might be a simpler solution.
  • Another participant argues that dark matter and dark energy represent evidence for physics beyond the standard model, suggesting that a new theory is needed to address existing gaps in understanding, such as black hole singularities.
  • There is a question raised about whether the accelerating expansion of the universe should be interpreted as a manifestation of a cosmological constant rather than dark energy.
  • A participant notes the lack of relevance of dark matter in the ESA article, indicating a focus on dark energy instead.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the existence and implications of dark energy and dark matter, with no consensus reached on their validity or how they should be integrated into existing theories.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the need for a new theoretical framework to address unresolved issues in physics, indicating limitations in current models and the potential for alternative explanations.

stevebd1
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'XMM-Newton’s massive discovery'
25 August 2008

'ESA’s orbiting X-ray observatory XMM-Newton has discovered the most massive cluster of galaxies seen in the distant Universe until now. The galaxy cluster is so big that there can only be a handful of them at that distance, making this a rare catch indeed. The discovery confirms the existence of dark energy.'


http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMY70XIPIF_index_0.html

http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object/index.cfm?fobjectid=43263

http://arxiv.org/abs/0805.3817
 
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stevebd1 said:
'XMM-Newton’s massive discovery'
25 August 2008

The discovery confirms the existence of dark energy.'


hogwash. does nothing of the kind. only the first of the articles even mentions any connection between the discovery and dark energy. DE and DM are a myth - we just haven't quite figured out everything there is to know about gravity yet...
 
if anyone is interested in debunking my statement above, please address in your response how you think dark matter and dark energy would fit into the standard model, and, if we apply occam's razor, why reconsidering the csomological constant would not be a simpler possible solution than dreaming up things that do not fit into any prior evidential history. thanks.
 
jnorman,

Why should anyone try to make DM and DE fit into the standard model of particle physics? Clearly they are astronomical evidence for physics beyond the standard model. The standard model clearly is in need of an overhaul (i.e. a new theory must be able to deal with black hole singularities, quantum foam, etc.) and DM and DE might be able to guide us to either a Theory of Everything (i.e. unification all 4 forces) or at least a Grand Unified Theory (i.e. unification Strong, Weak, and EM forces) .

I also don't understand what you're saying about DE and cosmological constant. Are you suggesting that we interpret the accelerating expansion as a manifestation of a cosmological constant and and not use the phrase, "dark energy?" Or are you saying that we should create a new gravitational theory that naturally explains the accelerating expansion?
 
I missed the part where dark matter was topical in the esa article, jnorman.
 

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