Can Information Be Stored in Non-Physical Fields?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Why
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Information
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of whether information can be stored in non-physical fields, exploring theoretical and experimental perspectives. Participants examine various models and ideas related to information storage, including vibrations, electromagnetic fields, and morphogenetic fields.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that information could be stored in non-physical fields, referencing Rupert Sheldrake's ideas despite skepticism from the scientific community.
  • One participant questions whether vibrations could serve as a medium for storing information, citing the concept of vibrating strings.
  • Another participant suggests that radio signals and light from distant stars represent forms of information stored in electromagnetic fields, although transient in nature.
  • A participant describes historical computing methods, such as IBM's magnetic memory, to illustrate how information can be stored but notes the time-sensitive nature of such storage.
  • One idea presented involves a circular energy movement that could potentially carry information, although it is critiqued as resembling a perpetual motion machine, which raises concerns about thermodynamics.
  • Another participant argues that controlling one force with another requires energy input, referencing the second law of thermodynamics and questioning the feasibility of maintaining such a system without energy loss.
  • Some participants express curiosity about the existence of subtle force fields that may not yet be measurable, particularly in relation to morphogenetic fields.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views, with no consensus reached on the feasibility of storing information in non-physical fields. Disagreement exists regarding the validity of certain models and the implications of thermodynamic laws.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the speculative nature of some ideas presented, dependence on definitions of fields and information, and unresolved questions about the practicality of proposed systems.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in theoretical physics, information theory, and the intersection of science and speculative concepts may find this discussion relevant.

Why
Messages
12
Reaction score
0
Can Information...?

Be stored in a non-physical field?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Morpho-genetic

Biochemist Rupert Sheldrake is a proponent although many debunk him there have been some experiments confirming.

Can information move in a repetitive motion creating a 'field' and hold the signal or information intact?
 
Vibration?

What about a vibration?

Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary
Main Entry: vi·brate
Pronunciation: 'vI-"brAt, esp British vI-'
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): vi·brat·ed; vi·brat·ing
Etymology: Latin vibratus, past participle of vibrare to brandish, wave, rock -- more at WIPE
transitive senses
1 : to swing or move to and fro

Many scientists believe in vibrating strings...as a layman I would love some scientific input on this idea...thanks!
 
Isn't a radio signal information "stored" in a field? It's not stored very long but it is there.

On the other hand, we get "information" about the makeup of a distant star from its light. Wasn't that information stored in the electromagnetic field for, possibly, thousands of years?
 
Even simpler the old IBM memory model rows and rows of small torus shaped magnets with a charge for 1 and no charge for 0 (the atoms aligned where the magnitic field is produced or random alignment where there is no magnetic field)

Or a laser where photons race back and forth between two mirrors with one at 100% reflectivity and one at 99%, it emerges as coherent light which can be modulated by varience of the input voltage.

This case like other posted examples tho are time "sensitive", which means once the information flows past us it is gone.
I can't think of any case where a standing wave is produced where it is persistent and self reinforcing that does not require instrumentalities.
 
Last edited:
Nice!

Thanks TillEulenspiegel
Nice!
My idea on the nonphysical information storage field would be a weaker circular energy movement carrying the information held inside a stronger spherical energy loop ...
(dissected view)
Loop within a loop.
a440.GIF


PS: I'm thinking a machine could initiate the energetic sphere but it would be self-sustaining.
 
Last edited:
Ummm well I'm sorry but what you propose is a sort of perpetual motion schema. As it violates the laws of thermodynamics I'm afraid it is not possible.

Edit to add:

BTW most of the responsible scientific community consider Rupert Sheldrake's claims to be "woo-woo"
 
Last edited:
Hey again Tell...yeah I know abour Sheldrakes rep.

As it violates the laws of thermodynamics I'm afraid it is not possible.
Why not?
 
You cannot have a field or force that controls another force without expending energy. Which in turn means that the controlling force must be "fed" energy to add back the energy that it expends to control the first force. The second law states that all systems move toward entropy with times arrow ( 1 way, forward ) so if you don't "recover"the expended energy the two forces will move toward equilibrium and the second force will not be able to control the first one thereby losing your information. Magnetic "bottles"are used to contain particles and plasmas but the useful ones are electro magnets, I suppose you could confine some less energetic particles with super strong rare Earth magnets and arrange the spin state of the particles to be the" information " (CW spin=0 CCW=1) but to what end?
 
  • #10
Possibly there are force fields which are so subtle that we currently can't measure them?
I'm trying to determine if morphogentic fields are a possibility.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 76 ·
3
Replies
76
Views
7K
  • Sticky
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
8K
  • · Replies 23 ·
Replies
23
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
1K