How can you evaluate this integral using an analytic method?

Click For Summary
The discussion focuses on evaluating the integral ∫_a^b [∫ y dx] x dx, where x is expressed as a function of y, but y is not explicitly defined in terms of x. The user suggests that by finding dx in terms of dy, the evaluation can be simplified using the relationship x = f(y). It is noted that the integral can be expressed as the product of two separate integrals, leading to a formula involving the definite integral of y. The conversation also hints at a potential application of the mean value theorem or its inverse in this context. Overall, the approach emphasizes the importance of transforming variables to facilitate analytic evaluation of the integral.
JulieK
Messages
50
Reaction score
0
I know the value of the following definite integral

\int_{a}^{b}ydx

I also have a realtion

x=f(y)

i.e. x is an explicit function of y but I do not have y as an explicit
function of x. The relation between x and y is generally non linear.

Now I want to get the following definite integral

\int_{a}^{b}\left[\int ydx\right]xdx

i.e. \int ydx multiplied by x evaluated over the interval [a,b].

Is there an analytic (not numeric) way to evaluate this integral using
for example mean value or similar averaging technique?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Well, I think all you need to do is to find dx in terms of dy and then it should be simple since you already have x in terms of y, just sub in the integral.

dx=f'(y)dy
\displaystyle\large\therefore \int_a^b \left[\int ydx\right]xdx=\int_a^b \left[\int yf'(y)dy\right]f(y)f'(y)dy

You already have the value of the integral \displaystyle\large\int_a^b ydx=\int_a^b yf'(y)dy


I believe (but do not recall) that there is a way to use sort of the "opposite" of the mean value theorem.

Also, if possible, it would simply be easy enough to take f^{-1}(y)
 
JulieK said:
I know the value of the following definite integral

\int_{a}^{b}ydx

I also have a realtion

x=f(y)

i.e. x is an explicit function of y but I do not have y as an explicit
function of x. The relation between x and y is generally non linear.

Now I want to get the following definite integral

\int_{a}^{b}\left[\int ydx\right]xdx

i.e. \int ydx multiplied by x evaluated over the interval [a,b].

Is there an analytic (not numeric) way to evaluate this integral using
for example mean value or similar averaging technique?

Your integral is actually:
\begin{aligned}\int_{a}^{b}\left[\int ydx\right]xdx
&=\int_{a}^{b}\left[\int y(\xi) d\xi\right]xdx \\
&= \int_{a}^{b} xdx \cdot \int y(\xi) d\xi \\
&= \frac 1 2(b^2-a^2)\int y(\xi) d\xi \\
&= \frac 1 2(b^2-a^2) \int y dx \\
\end{aligned}
 
There are probably loads of proofs of this online, but I do not want to cheat. Here is my attempt: Convexity says that $$f(\lambda a + (1-\lambda)b) \leq \lambda f(a) + (1-\lambda) f(b)$$ $$f(b + \lambda(a-b)) \leq f(b) + \lambda (f(a) - f(b))$$ We know from the intermediate value theorem that there exists a ##c \in (b,a)## such that $$\frac{f(a) - f(b)}{a-b} = f'(c).$$ Hence $$f(b + \lambda(a-b)) \leq f(b) + \lambda (a - b) f'(c))$$ $$\frac{f(b + \lambda(a-b)) - f(b)}{\lambda(a-b)}...

Similar threads

  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 31 ·
2
Replies
31
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K