AI modelling pure animal instincts

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ephant
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Ai
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of AI modeling pure animal instincts, particularly focusing on predatory behaviors of animals like lions. Participants explore the awareness of animals during hunting, the comparison of animal instincts to human actions, and the implications for AI development in simulating such behaviors.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question whether lions are aware they are killing other creatures and how this awareness compares to human murderers.
  • There is a suggestion that animals may perceive their prey similarly to how humans view food, but this is debated.
  • One participant argues that hunting is driven by instinct and pleasure, not solely by hunger.
  • Another participant raises the idea of criminal trials for animals, referencing historical practices and the legal status of animals.
  • Concerns are expressed about the limitations of AI in replicating animal intelligence, with a comparison to simpler organisms like flatworms.
  • Participants discuss the experience of hunting and the intentions behind it, contrasting it with the perception of animals as food.
  • There is a proposal that before creating AI that mimics human thought, AI should first be developed to simulate animal instincts.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on animal awareness and instincts, with no clear consensus on the nature of animal cognition or the implications for AI development. The discussion remains unresolved with competing perspectives on these topics.

Contextual Notes

Some arguments rely on assumptions about animal cognition and the nature of hunting, which are not universally accepted. The discussion also touches on the legal implications of animal behavior, which may depend on varying definitions and contexts.

Ephant
Messages
147
Reaction score
2
When AI is mentioned, it is about trying to simulate human thinking. But how about an AI that can model pure animals like Lions. What do you call AI that simulates raw animal instinct.

While I'm at it (animal). I'd like to know the following.

1. When Lions eat the Buffalo alive. Are Lions aware they are killing other creatures? If yes, how does it differ to murderers? I mean, when murderers kill their victims. Are they considered as a Lion?

2. Do animals like Lions, tigers, Hyenas see other creatures like we see fried chicken already cooked that have 2 feet that can for example run. And so imagine all the animals are already cooked but alive. We can try to catch them and eat them immediately? Just want to know what is in the mind of animals when they hunt other animals and eat them immediately.

3. Would Androids with pure animal instinct without thinking be indistinguishable from animals like Lions? This is in order to understand the entire neural underpinnings or networks of animals. So far, what insect or animals can our AI fully simulate such that it can act like a real fly with behavior like that of a fly?
 
  • Skeptical
Likes   Reactions: PeroK
Computer science news on Phys.org
Ephant said:
Are Lions aware they are killing other creatures?
For sure they understand that after they act, something that was isn't the same anymore. What do you think when you remove a carrot from the ground and eat it? Do you realize you have just killed it?
Ephant said:
If yes, how does it differ to murderers?
Murder is a human concept where a law must be involved: It is murder when killing is forbidden by a law.
Ephant said:
Just want to know what is in the mind of animals when they hunt other animals and eat them immediately.
Most likely they look at it just like you look at an apple in a tree or a carrot in the ground.

Also, note that there is often more than a "food source" point of view for the animal, even though it is most likely the endpoint. For example, animals will often hunt even when they are already well-fed. It's in their DNA, the hunt gives them pleasure and they cannot resist the urge.
Ephant said:
This is in order to understand the entire neural underpinnings or networks of animals.
I don't think animals are so much different from humans. They also think up to a certain level. How else can a cat learn to open a door on its own?

 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: 256bits
Ephant said:
1. When Lions eat the Buffalo alive. Are Lions aware they are killing other creatures? If yes, how does it differ to murderers? I mean, when murderers kill their victims. Are they considered as a Lion?
Did you take into account that the animals that human beings eat have to be killed first?

If your idea is to bring back criminal trials for animals, you perhaps should read this first

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_trial
 
  • Wow
Likes   Reactions: Vanadium 50 and berkeman
Lion?

You understand that the best AI might be almost as smart as a flatworm, right?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: berkeman
Ephant said:
2. Do animals like Lions, tigers, Hyenas see other creatures like we see fried chicken already cooked that have 2 feet that can for example run. And so imagine all the animals are already cooked but alive. We can try to catch them and eat them immediately? Just want to know what is in the mind of animals when they hunt other animals and eat them immediately.
Have you ever been hunting? When you hunt with a rifle or pistol or shotgun or bow or knife, you are doing your best to kill your prey with the intention of eating it later. They never look cooked while you are hunting; they are doing their best to hide or get away, and you are doing your best to find them and not let them get away.

There are certainly times when you cook and eat your prey the same day there in the field, but more often you bring it back home for the feasting.

I get the feeling that you have little experience with both hunting and AI...
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Wrichik Basu and Vanadium 50
Had a friend get a moose license. Never bagged one, but if he did, shooting one is only the first of your problems.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: berkeman
PeroK said:
If your idea is to bring back criminal trials for animals, you perhaps should read this first
Not sure if it has gone away
as an example,
dog bites woman <-- provoked or unprovoked attack, circumstance and character of the animal can come into play

A wild animal would usually not put on trial for an incident, but given by living decree a status as a group, say as being protected, vermin, or something other.

I would tend to think the evolution of the human legal system , in part due to adaptation of property rights and tort law over the centuries, does involve the legal status of animals.
 
Ephant said:
Just want to know what is in the mind of animals when they hunt other animals and eat them immediately.
What is in your mind when you go hunting for food at the store.

Think deeply instead of just off the cuff " deep fried chicken' for my family.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: berkeman
berkeman said:
Have you ever been hunting?
1704065188585.png
 
  • #10
The bottom line is. Before we can create pure AI that think like us (for example, replacing your lover with AI and indistinguishable from human). You need to create AI based on animals first. Is it not?
 
  • Skeptical
Likes   Reactions: phinds, berkeman and PeroK
  • #11
Thread is closed for Moderation. Lordy.
 
  • #12
After a Mentor discussion, this thread is done.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Bystander

Similar threads

Replies
10
Views
5K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
7K
Replies
7
Views
6K
  • · Replies 45 ·
2
Replies
45
Views
6K
Replies
2
Views
4K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
6K