All about aluminium tetrafluoride

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around aluminium tetrafluoride (AlF3), specifically its properties, reactions with water, formation enthalpies, and availability. Participants seek information on material databases, safety data, and alternative substances with similar characteristics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • One participant requests data on aluminium tetrafluoride, including its reaction with water and formation enthalpies.
  • Another participant questions the completeness of the term "aluminium tetrafluoride," suggesting it lacks specificity.
  • A participant references a patent that mentions aluminium fluoride, although there is confusion about the correct chemical formula.
  • Some participants clarify that aluminium fluoride is AlF3, not AlF4, and provide links to safety data sheets and other resources.
  • Concerns are raised about the high cost of aluminium fluoride, with one participant suggesting they should look for alternatives due to the expense.
  • There is a discussion about the chemical inertness of aluminium fluoride at room temperature and its implications for exothermic reactions.
  • One participant expresses a need for information on exothermic reactions involving aluminium fluoride and seeks suggestions for other substances that might fit this criterion.
  • Another participant mentions that sodium aluminum fluoride (Cryolite) is a naturally occurring substance and could be a more cost-effective option.
  • Confusion arises regarding the relationship between Cryolite and aluminium fluoride, with participants debating their chemical composition and separation methods.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the specifics of aluminium tetrafluoride, its properties, or the best alternatives. Multiple competing views and uncertainties remain regarding the chemical behavior and cost of the substances discussed.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved questions regarding the exothermic reactions of aluminium fluoride with water, the accuracy of cost estimates, and the chemical distinctions between aluminium fluoride and Cryolite.

kandelabr
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Hello.

I can't find any data on aluminium tetrafluoride. I am looking for its reaction with water, formation enthalpies, temperatures and anything/everything else.

Could someone give me at least a hint where to look at, a material database, a book, website, anything...?

Thanks!
 
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kandelabr said:
aluminium tetrafluoride

Sodium? Potassium? Aluminum tetrafluoride is not a full name. It is like stating "I can't information about chloride".
 
kandelabr said:
Aluminum floride (I guess it's AlF4).

You guess wrong, no wonder you can't find anything. It is AlF3.
 
kandelabr:
Here is a link to a Material Safety Data Sheet (MSDS) for AlF3:
http://www.solvaychemicals.us/static/wma/pdf/5/1/1/9/ALF.pdf
 
Last edited by a moderator:
yes, I've seen this but it doesn't contain any data i am looking for.

i also found out prices for this material are ~100$ per gram. i would need ~100 kg. since i don't have millions, i guess i should be looking for something else?
 
Try this link:
http://www.alcoa.com/alumina_minerals/north_america/en/pdf/aluminafluoride.pdf

You will note that this material is chemically inert at room temps. I don't know why you need formation enthalpies since this material is produced on an industrial scale.

Your price information seems to be off as well. It comes in 50 and 100 pound bags, which at a price of $100/g, would cost either $2.25 mil or $4.5 mil.
 
SteamKing said:
... I don't know why you need formation enthalpies since this material is produced on an industrial scale...

sorry, i was wrong - i don't need to know formation enthalpies, i need to know how much energy is released when this thing reacts with water to form a hydrate and how do i reverse this reaction.

and maybe not only for aluminium fluoride, could be any other substance. in general, i am looking for a strongly exothermic reaction that is reversible. your ideas are very welcome, if you have any.

thanks.
 
I think the sentence "At ambient temperatures, it is chemically inactive." takes care of producing any strongly exothermic reactions.
 
  • #10
I don't know about the exothermic reaction of AlF3 with water, but you have a very good chance of getting this for lower cost because, Na3AlF6 is Cryolite and it is a naturally occurring substance.
 
  • #11
dmssrinivas said:
I don't know about the exothermic reaction of AlF3 with water, but you have a very good chance of getting this for lower cost because, Na3AlF6 is Cryolite and it is a naturally occurring substance.

No idea what you mean.
 
  • #12
Borek said:
No idea what you mean.

I mean, $100 a gram is too much for a naturally occurring substance.
 
  • #13
after a little research and a bit of luck, i found out it is actually AlF3. This is a really cheap substance, and in attachment below there is an article covering everything i was asking about.

thank you all for replies!
dmssrinivas: do you have some more information on this Na3AlF6? i don't mean wikipedia, something like the article i attached would be most welcome :)
 

Attachments

  • #14
dmssrinivas said:
I mean, $100 a gram is too much for a naturally occurring substance.

WHAT ABOUT DIAMONDS?!

(I'm kidding.)
 
  • #15
dmssrinivas said:
I mean, $100 a gram is too much for a naturally occurring substance.

Cryolite and AlF3 are two different substances.
 
  • #16
Borek said:
Cryolite and AlF3 are two different substances.

I thought Cryolite is 3(NaF).AlF3 and separation is easy. Sorry If I am wrong.
 

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