An abstract long-distance correlation experiment

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Discussion Overview

This thread explores a generalized form of an EPR-like experimental setting focused on long-distance correlation experiments in quantum mechanics. The discussion aims to abstract from conventional interpretations and distractions, concentrating on the essential elements of nonlocality and the implications of observer intelligence on quantum phenomena.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • The experimental setup involves a source sending signals to two devices operated by Alice and Bob, who are located more than 1km apart, with specific timing and recording protocols to ensure the purity of events.
  • Participants are invited to comment on the suitability of the experimental setting to demonstrate both classical and quantum behaviors related to nonlocality.
  • Improvements to the original setup have been made in response to earlier criticisms, and the basic setting is now considered stable and closed for further discussion.
  • Some participants question whether Norbert sends a signal to Bob every time a signal is sent to Alice or if he selects the direction of each signal, indicating a need for clarification on the signal transmission process.
  • Historical references are made to Bell's work, suggesting parallels between the current setup and Bell's discussions on reality and nonlocality.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding and clarity regarding the experimental setup, with some seeking further clarification on specific aspects. There is no consensus on the interpretation of the signal transmission process, indicating ongoing debate.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes unresolved questions about the nature of signal transmission and the implications of the experimental design on the interpretation of results. Participants have differing levels of familiarity with the terminology and concepts involved.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those exploring quantum mechanics, nonlocality, and experimental setups in physics, particularly in the context of Bell-type experiments and their interpretations.

  • #241
stevendaryl said:
[...]
However, I still don't understand what his interpretation really is, or how it applies in the most interesting case--EPR.
IIUC, it's still only an interpretation. The idea is that correlations are what's physically real. Then, since the correlata are unphysical, it's a red herring that they "seem" to influence each other superluminally. One should instead concentrate on how correlations evolve.

But like all interpretations, one's tummy is left feeling insufficiently fed. Afaict, there's not really any new tangible physics there -- just a different way of thinking about things that (hopefully) banishes some of the older philosophical puzzles.

I wonder whether Mermin still lives here [Ithaca]
His webpage at Cornell University still seems active, though he retired 10 yrs ago. I was interested to see that the leading quote on his webpage (from 1931) is relevant to this thread:

"Quantum mechanics forbids statements about the object. It deals only with the object-subject relation." — Schroedinger to Sommerfeld, 1931.

Apparently Mermin is also responsible for the "shut up and calculate" phrase.
 
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  • #242
ddd123 said:
That's very interesting, are there explicit constructions?
You asked about this a long time ago and I found this paper (*).

Instead of polarisers the theory and experiment uses phase plates('parity rotators'). This means they are looking for correlations in the spatial domain and they map the infinite dimensional position space into 2D parity space so the CHSH inequality can be realized. The important thing is that the correlations are explicitly non-local as shown in equation (2).

I see this as possible support for the change in the correlations ( ie probabilities of coincidences) at phase-velocity.
Or perhaps I'm just out-of-phase on this.

(*)
Experimental Violation of Bell’s Inequality in Spatial-Parity Space

Timothy Yarnall, Ayman F. Abouraddy,Bahaa E. A. Saleh, Malvin C. Teich
http://arxiv.org/pdf/0708.0653.pdf

We report the first experimental violation of Bell’s inequality in the spatial domain using the
Einstein–Podolsky–Rosen state. Two-photon states generated via optical spontaneous parametric
downconversion are shown to be entangled in the parity of their one-dimensional transverse spatial
profile. Superpositions of Bell states are prepared by manipulation of the optical pump’s transverse
spatial parity—a classical parameter. The Bell-operator measurements are made possible by devising
simple optical arrangements that perform rotations in the one-dimensional spatial-parity space of
each photon of an entangled pair and projective measurements onto a basis of even–odd functions.
A Bell-operator value of 2.389 ± 0.016 is recorded, a violation of the inequality by more than 24
standard deviations
 
Last edited:
  • #243
wle said:
.. Does this help?

Sure does, Thanks a lot.

Sorry for slow response, I was out of internet access for 2 weeks. :)
 

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