An interesting Nonlinear Differential Equation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a nonlinear second-order differential equation related to the motion of a free-falling object without air resistance, specifically in the form ##y^2y'' + K = 0##, where ##K## is a positive constant. Participants are seeking strategies for solving this equation and exploring its implications in both gravitational and electrostatic contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express difficulty in finding a starting point for solving the nonlinear differential equation, noting that traditional resources assume constant gravitational acceleration.
  • One participant suggests that the equation can be transformed into a more manageable form by multiplying by ##y'## and integrating, leading to a relationship involving ##y'## and ##y##.
  • Another participant proposes an alternate approach by rewriting the equation and integrating, leading to expressions for ##\dot{y}## and time ##t## in terms of ##y## and constants.
  • There is a discussion about the implications of the nonlinear term and its origin, with questions raised about the role of distance in gravitational force.
  • Some participants explore numerical solutions and graphical representations to validate their analytical approaches.
  • References to potential energy in the context of gravitational and electrostatic forces are made, with discussions about the nature of attraction and repulsion based on the sign of ##K##.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach to solve the equation, and there are multiple competing views on the implications of the nonlinear term and the nature of the forces involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the equation's complexity arises from its nonlinear nature, and there are unresolved questions about the assumptions made regarding gravitational force and the effects of distance.

Isaac0427
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TL;DR
I have been thinking about the differential equation for the motion of a free falling object without air resistance (on my own, not as homework), which is in the form ##y^2y''+K=0## with ##K## as a positive constant. I'm looking for advice on a first step to solve this equation.
That's pretty much it. If there is a very basic strategy that I am forgetting from ODEs, please let me know, though I don't recall any strategies for nonlinear second order equations.

I've tried looking up "motion of a free falling object" with various specifications to try to get the solution to this equation, but the sources I find still always assume ##g## does not vary with distance. I have also tried looking up "motion of a charge in a coulomb field" but to no avail.

Thank you in advance!
 
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I looked up the solution and it didn't give any hint how to start, it looks awful.
 
fresh_42 said:
I looked up the solution and it didn't give any hint how to start, it looks awful.
Where does one find the solution? Wolfram Alpha didn't come up with anything.

I could try to reverse engineer it, or in any case check a few things with the solution that I've wanted to look at.
 
where does the nonlinear term come from if there is no air resistance?
 
Isaac0427 said:
Summary:: I have been thinking about the differential equation for the motion of a free falling object without air resistance (on my own, not as homework), which is in the form ##y^2y''+K=0## with ##K## as a positive constant. I'm looking for advice on a first step to solve this equation.

That's pretty much it. If there is a very basic strategy that I am forgetting from ODEs, please let me know, though I don't recall any strategies for nonlinear second order equations.

I've tried looking up "motion of a free falling object" with various specifications to try to get the solution to this equation, but the sources I find still always assume ##g## does not vary with distance. I have also tried looking up "motion of a charge in a coulomb field" but to no avail.

Thank you in advance!

This is of the form y&#039;&#039; = f(y) with f(y) = - K/y^2, so multiplying by y&#039; and integrating is the first step: <br /> y&#039; = \pm \sqrt{C + \frac{2K}{y}}. Getting any further requires that you be able to solve <br /> \int \sqrt{\frac{y}{Cy + 2K}}\,dy = t analytically.

Given your actual question, setting r = R + y, where R is the radius of the Earth and y is height above the surface, in <br /> r&#039;&#039; = \frac{-K}{r^2} will yield <br /> y&#039;&#039; = - \frac{K}{R^2}\left(1 + \frac{y}{R}\right)^{-2} and on the assumption that y/R \ll 1 you can expand the right hand side in binomial series to either O(1) (getting the familiar constant acceleration) or to O(y/R), getting <br /> y&#039;&#039; = - \frac{K}{R^2}\left(1 - \frac{2y}{R}\right) which is a second-order non-homogenous linear ODE with constant coefficients.
 
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As an alternate approach to @pasmith consider the DE,
$$
y^2\ddot{y}=-K
$$
and observe,
$$
\ddot{y}=\dot{y}\frac{d\dot{y}}{dy}
$$
so that
$$
\dot{y}\frac{d\dot{y}}{dy}=-\frac{K}{y^2}
$$
and thus,
$$
\int_{\dot{y}_0}^{\dot{y}}\dot{y}d\dot{y}=-K\int_{y_0}^{y}\frac{dy}{y^2}
$$
$$
\frac{1}{2}[\dot{y}^2 - \dot{y}_0^2]=K[\frac{1}{y}-\frac{1}{y_0}]
$$
where ##y_0## is the initial position and ##\dot{y}_0## is the initial velocity. We have,
$$
\frac{dy}{dt}=\sqrt{2}\sqrt{\frac{K}{y} + C}
$$
$$
C=\frac{1}{2}\dot{y_0}^2-\frac{K}{y_0}
$$
$$
t=\int_{y_0}^{y}\sqrt{\frac{y}{2K}}\frac{dy}{\sqrt{\frac{Cy}{K}}+1}
$$
Make the substitution,
$$
u^2=\frac{Cy}{K}
$$
to get,
$$
t=\frac{\sqrt{2}K}{C^{\frac{3}{2}}}\int_{\sqrt{\frac{Cy_0 }{K}}}^{\sqrt{\frac{Cy }{K}}}\frac{u^2du}{\sqrt{u^2+1}}
$$
Integrating by parts we find,
$$
t=\frac{K}{\sqrt{2}C^{\frac{3}{2}}}[u\sqrt{u^2+1}-\sinh^{-1}(u)]|_{\sqrt{\frac{Cy_0}{K}}}^{\sqrt{\frac{Cy}{K}}}

$$
Clearly ##y(t)## can't be expressed in terms of elementary functions, but you can make a plot of y vs. t by plugging in y values and computing t.
 
Here's how I would check it:

In Fred's solution above:
$$(y')^2=2K(1/y-1/y_0)+(y_0')^2$$
I chose the negative root and solved:
$$y'=-\sqrt{2K/y+c},\quad c=(y_0')^2-2K/y_0$$
to obtain:
$$
x(c,K,y)=\frac{2 K \tanh ^{-1}\left(\frac{\sqrt{c+\frac{2 K}{y}}}{\sqrt{c}}\right)}{c^{3/2}}-\frac{y \sqrt{c+\frac{2K}{y}}}{c}
$$
Next, I solved a test IVP numerically in Mathematica with y(0)=10, y'(0)=0 and K=1 and plotted the solution as the gray trace in the plot below:

[CODE title="Mathematica"]mySol = First@
NDSolve[{y[t]^2 y''[t] + 1 == 0, y[0] == 10, y'[0] == 0},
y, {t, 0, 10}]
theTrace[t_] = Evaluate[Flatten[y[t] /. mySol]];
dPlot = Plot[theTrace[t], {t, 0, 10}][/CODE]

Then I superimposed a parametric plot of {x(c,K,y),y} over this solution as the red dashed lines to confirm the analytic solution matches the numeric solution:

[CODE title="Mathematica"]
myf[c_, k_, y_] = Integrate[-1/Sqrt[2 k/y + c], y]
pp1 = ParametricPlot[{myf[-1/5, 1, y], y}, {y, 9, 10},
AspectRatio -> 1, PlotStyle -> {Dashed, Red}]
Show[{dPlot, pp1}][/CODE]
desolution.jpg
 
Last edited:
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$$L=\frac{1}{2}y'^2-V,\quad V=-\frac{K}{y}$$
1-dimensional motion in Coulomb's field
 
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  • #10
Or gravitational - inverse square law? Solutions well known
:olduhh:
 
  • #11
Gravitation can only attract, here attraction or repulsion depend on the sign of K
inverse square law is for force, for the potential just 1/y
 
  • #12
wrobel said:
Gravitation can only attract, here attraction or repulsion depend on the sign of K
inverse square law is for force, for the potential just 1/y
Ah, it was late at night, I thought something might be not quite right, note the emoticon. OK he said K positive. But anyone who can do it for K negative can for K positive I'd think.
 
  • #13
bigfooted said:
where does the nonlinear term come from if there is no air resistance?
Force varies with distance from the center of Earth.
Fred Wright said:
and observe,
y¨=y˙dy˙dy
so that
Where does this come from? I may just be missing something obvious here.
 

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