Are Beats and Standing Waves Related in Physics?

  • Context: High School 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Bilbo B
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Standing waves Waves
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between beats and standing waves in physics, exploring the nature of these waves, their characteristics, and how they relate to harmonics and tones. Participants examine both longitudinal and transverse waves, their modes, and the implications for sound production in various contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the differentiation between longitudinal and transverse standing waves, suggesting that beats may be an extension of longitudinal waves and inquiring about the presence of harmonics in both types.
  • Another participant emphasizes the need for clarity on which type of waves are being discussed, noting that higher modes are not necessarily harmonics and should be referred to as overtones, which may differ from harmonic frequencies.
  • A third participant introduces the concept of harmony as a natural phenomenon that produces various waveforms, suggesting that instrumental strings can create superpositions of different wavelengths, and relates this to the perception of sound and light.
  • A later reply questions the relevance and clarity of the previous contributions, seeking a more focused discussion on the physics involved.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the definitions and relationships between beats, standing waves, and harmonics. There is no consensus on the nature of these relationships or the terminology used, indicating ongoing debate and exploration of the topic.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not fully resolved the definitions of terms such as harmonics and overtones, nor have they clarified the specific context of the waves being discussed, which may affect the understanding of the relationships between beats and standing waves.

Bilbo B
Messages
9
Reaction score
1
TL;DR
How does the standing waves relate to beats? There are nodes and antinodes in case of standing waves but how these nodes are related to find harmonics. The factors whether a string fixed at both ends or fixed at single end decides it's nature.
If the standing waves for beats are the longitudinal ones. what are the basis for differentiating from transverse.The beats have also nodes, there is a difference such from the transverse waves.Do they too have harmonics? the tones produced in case of beats also depends upon whether for e.g.closed and open organ pipes but I'm messed up with displacement and pressure nodes as you don't have pressure nodes in transverse waves. Beats if an elaborate extension of longitudinal waves, Can i consider them as same.
If the frequencies in transverse waves are integer multiples of lowest frequency, how they physically represent tones and harmonics.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
I think you would need to specify which waves you are discussing. In elementary wave theory, it's normal to consider either ideal transverse ( ideal strings) or ideal longitudinal wave models (ideal organ pipes).
Also I don't know what you mean by standing waves for beats. In a simple model, the various modes are independent. Perhaps if you told us the actual problem then it may trigger some useful thoughts.
Edit:
PS it's as well to start off on the right foot here. The higher modes in most cases are not actual harmonics ( not 2f,3f,4f etc). The natural frequencies are a function of the wavelengths and the effective length of a resonator and the family of higher frequency resonances are actually (should be) referred to as Overtones. They can be waaay off the harmonic frequencies.
 
Harmony is natures way of producing waves other than a sine, combined with a sine. It can be produced by many factors. An instrumental string in motion, is in many occasions in a super position, producing different wave lengths at the same time. I recommend you to read about analogue synthesizers for example. When it comes to standing waves, this is only an expression of trapped waves. For example waves in a corner bouncing forward and backwords that are not going anywhere.

The waves are all the same in different wavelengths and amplitude. This is why these lengths of waves are mostly perceived by your eardrum. Light and photons are also vibration, in many forms, only perceptible by your eyes.
 
Last edited:
Solomei said:
Harmony is natures way of producing waves other than a sine, combined with a sine. It can be produced by many factors. An instrumental string in motion, is in many occasions in a super position, producing different wave lengths at the same time. I recommend you to read about analogue synthesizers for example. When it comes to standing waves, this is only an expression of trapped waves. For example waves in a corner bouncing forward and backwords that are not going anywhere.

The waves are all the same in different wavelengths and amplitude. This is why these lengths of waves are mostly perceived by your eardrum. Light and photons are also vibration, in many forms, only perceptible by your eyes.
What is all that supposed to be about? Is there any actual Physics buried in there or did you just have a yearning to write a purple passage?
 

Similar threads

High School Solving Confusion with Waves in Physics
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
High School Audio frequency of a humidifier
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
805
High School Moving to a higher harmonic in a standing wave
  • · Replies 40 ·
2
Replies
40
Views
5K
High School What is the True Frequency of Sound When Striking Wood at Different Rates?
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
Graduate Where are the pressure nodes on a standing acoustic wave in water?
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
High School Is the Definition of a Standing Wave Accurate?
  • · Replies 19 ·
Replies
19
Views
3K
Undergrad Standing wave in cylindar vs cone
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
4K
Undergrad Are 1D Longitudinal Waves Reflected at an Open End?
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
Understanding Standing Waves in Open Tubes
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
Undergrad Way of producing 600kHz longitudinal waves - Piezo or siren
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
3K